Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: Nevermore's Ulti (requiem of souls) not doing any damage or ridiculously low

  1. #1
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    54

    Nevermore's Ulti (requiem of souls) not doing any damage or ridiculously low

    Hello,

    as the title says.

    Game Id : 5710725

    Sometime the combat logs says 120 damage to all (whatever the distance from nevermore, btw ...) but in game it's not even that. When it should be MUCH MUCH more obviously.

    You can see it in a fight around 35/36 minutes. Or you can see it even more clearly in a gank at the river during early/mid game, north of top rune (I don't have the exact time, replay is not yet ready, game just finished) where a balanar got ultied by a nevermore at DIRECT MELEE CONTACT RANGE and took ZERO damage, as well as a zeus player close by.

    Thanks.

  2. #2
    Basic Member BLABLAFU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,487
    Did you have full souls?

    Edit: watched the game. You didn't have full souls and were at least 300-400 range away from NS. And it did deal damage.
    Last edited by BLABLAFU; 02-18-2012 at 09:35 AM.

  3. #3
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    54
    Hello,

    1) I'm not the one playing Nevermore =)

    2) Their must be something wrong, look :


    First weird scene is at 13:20, this nevermore gets attacked by balanar + Zeus. He has only 3 souls, so he clearly must do very very little damage with his ulti, but still something very weird happens. This balanar is CLOSE RANGE STUCK ONTO HIM (you apparently misunderstood my first message, I clearly said that the close range balanar was this gank early game, not the gank late game that you watched) and here is what happened :

    He took ZERO damage, but on top of that he got, apparently, HEALED by nevermore ulti. Look precisely at 13:28. Watch it in slow motion 0.25 speed. Balanar has no life leech, he just used his last urn charge ON NEVERMORE to help kill him, he has no heals running on him, he has no healers on his team, no allied spells is cast on him. Nevertheless, before Requiem of Souls, he has 595 HPs. Right after requiem of souls (with 3 souls) he has :

    1) Taken ZERO damage, while being in full melee hitting Nevermore.

    2) He has GAINED 130HP from Nevermore's ulti, in a quarter of a second, going to 630HP instantly.

    We are talking about a balanar with no healing spells whatsoever running on him, no healers in his team. And his items are exactly : boot, urn of shadow with no charge (he earns 2 charges after killing nevermore this way, but urn is on CD anyway), Glove of haste, Quelling blade.

    Now please, explain to me this great mistery of Dota. Is Requiem of souls supposed to :

    1) Heal peoples.

    2) Cause Zero damage (with 3 souls) to people stuck next to you. (Spells mechanic reads : "one wave of damage for every 2 souls").

    Now, unto the clash that you watched, the one I gave you the timer for. Requiem of souls happens exactly at 36:20. Ennemies are stuck inside chronosphere. Nevermore ulti at the limit of the allied chronosphere. He has 22 Souls out of 32 max. Let's look at what happens :

    Now, I know that Requiem of souls have a special damage mecanics, I was already there back in the days of Dota-allstars.com so I've watched the diagrams pictures with all the "ellipses-like" rosace coming out of nevermore representing the damage waves, and explaining how the damage is lowered the farther away you are, etc ... I know full-well about this. Obviously I don't have the devellopers's debug mode to see exactly what happened behind the scenes in term of damage, so I won't get too much into how much damage it did (altought it did RIDICULOUSLY LOW damage to someone just 300 range away) but still there is one thing that defies logic in this fight, like in the previous fight, and this too, warrants an explanation :

    If you look closely you'll see that amongst the people hit by the Requiem of Souls, inside the chronosphere, is a Clinkz. This clinkz is much farther away than balanar from Nevermore. Almost twice the distance, roughly 600 range. He gets hit by this requiem of souls for EXACTLY : 266 damage (in 3 fast waves, the damage from Requiem of souls comes in wave, as you must know), going from 828 to 562. He's at 600 range. Now, the balanar who's in front of nevermore, inside the chronosphere, hit by a tower and a Faceless void, looses exactly 246 damage, going from 1600 to 1354 exclusively from the requiem of souls (I separated the inbetween damage from the void's hit in slow motion, but you can clearly see them, he even gets bashed and it his shown as a debuff). By the way, this balanar has no Hood, no cloak, no magic damage reduction, no positive buff on him whatsoever.

    Now, please, explain to me how is it possibly not a bug that a requiem of soul will, in the same game :

    1) Heal an enemy 130HP.

    2) Cause ZERO damage at point blank range with 3 souls.

    3) Cause more damage (rougly equal but still more damage) to a 600 range clinz than a less than 300 range Balanar.

    4) And cause only so low damage in any case, with 22 souls out of 32 max souls, on a lvl 16 ulti.


    This shit is out of the twillight zone, and needs to get fixed, as far as I'm concerned. This is a clear bug, and if you simply discard it, I can bet you that you'll hear from it again from many other persons.
    Last edited by Blah278; 02-18-2012 at 10:55 AM.

  4. #4
    Volunteer Moderator bu3ny's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    .-.
    Posts
    5,387
    Quote Originally Posted by Blah278 View Post
    First weird scene is at 13:20, this nevermore gets attacked by balanar + Zeus. He has only 3 souls, so he clearly must do very very little damage with his ulti, but still something very weird happens. This balanar is CLOSE RANGE STUCK ONTO HIM (you apparently misunderstood my first message, I clearly said that the close range balanar was this gank early game, not the gank late game that you watched) and here is what happened :

    He took ZERO damage, but on top of that he got, apparently, HEALED by nevermore ulti. Look precisely at 13:28. Watch it in slow motion 0.25 speed. Balanar has no life leech, he just used his last urn charge ON NEVERMORE to help kill him, he has no heals running on him, he has no healers on his team, no allied spells is cast on him. Nevertheless, before Requiem of Souls, he has 595 HPs. Right after requiem of souls (with 3 souls) he has :

    1) Taken ZERO damage, while being in full melee hitting Nevermore.

    2) He has GAINED 130HP from Nevermore's ulti, in a quarter of a second, going to 630HP instantly.

    We are talking about a balanar with no healing spells whatsoever running on him, no healers in his team. And his items are exactly : boot, urn of shadow with no charge (he earns 2 charges after killing nevermore this way, but urn is on CD anyway), Glove of haste, Quelling blade.

    Now please, explain to me this great mistery of Dota. Is Requiem of souls supposed to :

    1) Heal peoples.

    2) Cause Zero damage (with 3 souls) to people stuck next to you. (Spells mechanic reads : "one wave of damage for every 2 souls").

    Look closely and you'll clearly see that none of the lines of Nevermore's Ulti hit balanar. They missed him. His ulti doesn't deal the damage in the whole area, but around the lines. Imagine it like Dragon Slaves coming from Nevermore. None of the lines hit Balanar, thus he didn't got damaged.

    He didn't get healed, he (and zeus) leveled up after Nevermore died. His strength increased, thus is hp rised. It also wasn't 130 hp, but 35 hp (from 595 to 630hp)

    Quote Originally Posted by Blah278 View Post
    Now, unto the clash that you watched, the one I gave you the timer for. Requiem of souls happens exactly at 36:20. Ennemies are stuck inside chronosphere. Nevermore ulti at the limit of the allied chronosphere. He has 22 Souls out of 32 max. Let's look at what happens :

    Now, I know that Requiem of souls have a special damage mecanics, I was already there back in the days of Dota-allstars.com so I've watched the diagrams pictures with all the "ellipses-like" rosace coming out of nevermore representing the damage waves, and explaining how the damage is lowered the farther away you are, etc ... I know full-well about this. Obviously I don't have the devellopers's debug mode to see exactly what happened behind the scenes in term of damage, so I won't get too much into how much damage it did (altought it did RIDICULOUSLY LOW damage to someone just 300 range away) but still there is one thing that defies logic in this fight, like in the previous fight, and this too, warrants an explanation :

    If you look closely you'll see that amongst the people hit by the Requiem of Souls, inside the chronosphere, is a Clinkz. This clinkz is much farther away than balanar from Nevermore. Almost twice the distance, roughly 600 range. He gets hit by this requiem of souls for EXACTLY : 266 damage (in 3 fast waves, the damage from Requiem of souls comes in wave, as you must know), going from 828 to 562. He's at 600 range. Now, the balanar who's in front of nevermore, inside the chronosphere, hit by a tower and a Faceless void, looses exactly 246 damage, going from 1600 to 1354 exclusively from the requiem of souls (I separated the inbetween damage from the void's hit in slow motion, but you can clearly see them, he even gets bashed and it his shown as a debuff). By the way, this balanar has no Hood, no cloak, no magic damage reduction, no positive buff on him whatsoever.

    Balanar's hp before: 1601
    afterwards: 1220
    he took 381 damage from the ult (after magic reduction).

    Bone's hp before: 830
    afterwards: 573
    He took 257 damage from the ulti
    Bala got hit by 3 lines, bone by 2.

    Next time look at the hp values, not at the hp bar. Bala had way more max hp than Clinkz, so it looked like he took less damage.

    It didn't deal too low damage, didn't deal too much damage, didn't deal damage once, because it missed and didn't healed anyone. Everything happened as it should.

  5. #5
    Basic Member AlsOpRo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Jessica's Heart
    Posts
    130
    does balanar got a magic sticks ?

    EDIT : nvm, answered above ^

    Jessica Y U So Cute !!♥

  6. #6
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1
    At 36:20

    Clinkz goes from 829 hp to 710 hp, taking 120 damage from requiem and regenerating 1 hp.
    from 710 to 692 hp, taking 18 damage from Doom's scorched earth.
    from 692 to 573 hp, taking 120 damage from requiem and regenerating 1 hp.
    regens up to 577 hp
    from 577 to 560, taking 18 damage from scorched earth and regenerating 1 hp

    Night stalker goes from 1593 hp to 1474 hp, taking 120 damage from requiem and regenerating 1 hp.
    from 1474 to 1354 hp, taking 120 damage from requiem.

  7. #7
    Volunteer Moderator DLRevan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    2,917
    Watched the replay, both parts. While for the 2nd one it was not easy to discern where each instance of damage was coming from, I can say there's no bug involved.

    13mins: This one is bonehead obvious. SF had only 6 souls, causing him to release only 3 waves 60 degrees from each other. NS was standing exactly opposite one wave, and equidistant from the other two waves, causing them to miss SF entirely. The supposed heal NS got is because he leveled up 7 to 8 upon SF's death.

    36mins: Harder to figure out, but completely explainable. SF had 20 souls upon casting, releasing 10 waves. 2 waves hit NS for total of 240 dmg, as expected with 25% magic resist. It might seem at first that clinkz and zeus both got hit by one wave each, but took 240 as well, twice the expected damage, but actually both of them are sitting in the overlapping AOE zones for 2 waves. Requiem's waves are not really lines, but more like fans. The further out you go, the more adjacent waves overlap. Have a look here http://www.playdota.com/forums/showt...37#post2519237

    This chart shows how it works for 15 waves, but there's still overlap for 10. Because of how the aoe expands further out, the higher the soul count, the greater proportion of overlap closer in than further out, and vice versa.

    Also, its only 20 souls upon casting. SF gained two more souls from creeps he killed with requiem.


    TLDR: In both instances Requiem is working just fine. And to be honest, when you actually thought that extra hp NS got from leveling up was from some heal, and missed that SF had only 20 souls and not 22, I had a feeling you misinterpreted everything else.

    EDIT: Ninja'ed....btw bu3ny im pretty sure NS got hit by only 2 waves. At 10 waves they were pretty spread out, and i calculated around 240 dmg from requiem, the rest from void and NS's armlet being active. Either way though, everything seems fine.
    Last edited by DLRevan; 02-18-2012 at 12:38 PM.
    Always read and follow the forum rules. If you need help from a moderator, use the report button ()
    Before posting new bugs:
    -Check the Known Bugs List and search the forum for an existing report.
    -Make sure its a bug (test in WC3 Dota, visit playdota guides and adv. mech, etc). If you're still not sure, post in Mechanics and Gameplay Bug Brainstorming instead.
    -Read the Bug Posting Guidelines on how to report a bug properly.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •