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Bots- my feedback

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  • Bots- my feedback

    i have to say i am just an anverage dota 2 player who practicing unfair bots atm before going into real matchs. I appariciate the amount of work been put into these bots and they are certainly challenging and fun at times, however there are several problems i feel i need to address.

    Dota 2 bots Ai is much better than league of legends bots BUT i feel like they behave the exact same way: pick stun heros, stun heros and more stun heros -.- find a target and unload everything they get to make sure that person's day is ruined, this is fine by me because it teaches you to not get a mistake. HOWEVER when i am at half hp and about to die, these bots should not ever unload their entire skill set to me and left themselves with nothing.

    often when i am playing unfair bot i find one player gets boated by kunkka, stuned by both vs and sven and then ulted by lina with only 1k hp =.- then carry such as luna rider and TA in the player team proceed to rape faces as bots have absolutly NOTHING,NOTHING LEFT to defend themself.

    oh look i got comboed to death without a chance to survive, oh nevermind my team just got a rampage -.-

    this happesn so often it is insane, once these bots goes as far as follow me to tier 1 tower with half hp to kill me follow by my team luna rider triple kill and morted double kill on bot team, seriously?
    when i die i should say: oh stupid me, i died and i made the team vunlerable by making them 4v5
    not
    oh dear i wish i could get that triple kill
    these bots just goes batshit sometimes and forget any possible threat when it comes to team fight, throw everything at one person and proceed to feed 1k gold to enermy carry, these does not promote any useful play for the players other than fountain farming bots later.

    the way these bots ganks are ridicoulous too, they do not hide when ganking, they do not try to take invis rune to gank and instead they just walk up to you and does nothing, ganking as early as level 2, miss loads of exp and gold and fails at it. their gank is so obvious that they have to rely on stuns just to get one kill then all die to others that are alive.

    they dont gank mid often either, as a carry i manage to farm mid for 20 minute with a tower pushed and bots dont even bother to walk past the river....
    TA is just too good in bot game because all bots have burst damage and long cooldown, once they unload everything on refraction, TA proceed to rampage and slaughter everything she sees

    another thing to bots is their stupid laning phase, i manage to hit VS from full to 1/5 hp using a disruptor, she literually does nothing but running away, she does not fight back she does not stun, the only time she stuns is when she is ganking. she doesnt even get back to base, after eating another tango that boost her to a pitiful 2/5 hp she proceed to get back to lane, stun by NA in my team and feed first blood.

    they send tiny against hero such as viper, silencer and light keeper, this is enough said.....the amount of faceroll by those hero on that poor tiny is unimaginable

    so yeah at mid game the bot team is still level 6- or even worse while our void farmed up a mask of madness and proceed to get butterfly with no death and level 10, yep...

    seriously sometimes i thought: oh i got these core items and a luxery! at 27 minute, not bad and then only to realise all my teamates are fountain farming those bots, they are just terrible at getting gold and exp, only rely on that insane stun combo then does nothing after.

    i have to mention this serious bot behaviour when they get silenced, as silencer use global silence all bots do is sit there (only sniper doesnt..because he is right clicker) and let silencer shred the entire team, they dont even auto, they move to your face and stand there. i was 500 hp once and i manage to get 1 kill while facing the entire bot team with 200 hp left thanks to this stupid behaviour.

    so yeah this is just problem i found, i would like to say again i apparaciate the amount of work put into these bots but these behaviour i found on bots is just abit silly.
    Last edited by sephelutis; 07-30-2012, 06:41 AM.

  • #2
    1 thing: in most bot games (and most pub games, for what i've played), people expect mid too be ganking, not other lanes to be ganking mid. Because mid isn't sharing exp, they're expected to have a higher rate of farm and a higher level.

    I will note that in pro games, mid does get ganks though, but not really in pubs...

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    • #3
      I found that same problems too and it kind of weird because the last patch kind of made the bots more stupid than before. Also the unfair bots seem like they just make your team stupid instead of increasing the ai strategy because my teammates bots always running into enemy base and get themselves kill if that ain't enough they all just bad at everything. I really start to think that the last patch make the bots worse than they were earlier.

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      • #4
        The exp loss and item builds (if there are such things) hurt bots badly. I'm sure that the developers already realise the significant level / item differences at the end of a game.

        Personally (purely from an observer point of view), I feel that the current strategies and co-operative behaviours are fine, given that bots have competitive resources that human players can gather. Similarly I would say that without solving fundamental issues such as exp and items, trying to pull off higher level strategies may be very ineffective.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by 0ffkilter View Post
          1 thing: in most bot games (and most pub games, for what i've played), people expect mid too be ganking, not other lanes to be ganking mid. Because mid isn't sharing exp, they're expected to have a higher rate of farm and a higher level.

          I will note that in pro games, mid does get ganks though, but not really in pubs...
          I guess it really entirely depends on your two things: the skill level of the game and the hero playing mid. Mid is often times a great place to gank if you have the right heroes for the job. Mid should stay in lane and farm as much as possible until absolutely neccesary to leave and gank. There are exceptions, like Pudge, Tiny, or Nightstalker who take mid to get early levels, an important core item to gank, or both, and then leave fairly early from the lane to gank.

          You send people mid for multiple reasons: 1) to get as much gold as possible while also grabbing solo exp in order to be as prepared as possible for the team fights, 2) to solely get enough solo exp to start ganking early, hopefully getting some decent farm as well for a couple of items, 3) to shut down the enemy mid, preventing them from getting farm. You never really should want to leave mid alone to free farm for very long.

          Giving someone who excels in mid free farm is just a bad idea because there is no one there denying, or harassing them so they will safely get the optimal amount of gold and exp as opposed to someone mitigating it. This is why people gank mid in higher tier games as opposed to mid ganking other lanes. To forcibly deny/lose the enemy farm and give your mid farmer more gold for being in range when they die.

          @OP: You can't really expected too much yet, there are only 14 heroes in the bot pool and therefore Tiny is going to have to go up against facerollers.

          As of the recent patch I would argue that you're wrong about bots not ganking mid. If you start to pull away from the mid hero bot in terms of levels or farm 1 or 2 other bots will show up and try to stop you from getting more, especially if you start attacking their mid tower. Granted, it's usually a bit late by that point, it still happens.

          It will still take some time, but I think the bots work much better as a team than they did before; going to Roshan, taking action against pushes, showing up in a lane where someone on the opposing team is doing better than their team mates in the same lane, etc... Those are some fundamentals the bots need to be good at before they can get better in other regards.

          Just like new players, you might know how to cast your stuns, but you don't realize casting your stun at the same time someone else casts theirs is a bad idea, or that burning your Laguna Blade on a hero with 56 hp left is also a bad idea. They don't suddenly just become good at all things all at once. It's the same with bots, especially when you consider that their skill has to be written by programmers as opposed to just acertaining knowledge by playing over and over and watching people play over and over. It's a longer road. As the saying goes: 1 step backward, 2 steps forward. They may be worse than they were a week ago in some regards, but they're better in other areas and that doesn't mean they'll stay bad with they're ability usage.
          This ain't ova.

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          • #6
            i have a much much harder time against bane bot, lina bot or any ranged bot, the question is why cant bots do that everytime instead sending a poor tiny to get facerolled, they already have excellent choice of hero

            with tiny mid i can even send antimage free farm 15 minute to battlefury and get rampage( and thats exactly what happened at one unfair bot game, someone pick antimage, go mid, proceed to ignore everything and farm, 15 minute later rampage and kill everything he sees while the rest of team just watchs -.-)

            Comment


            • #7
              Yeah, haha. Getting Tiny in mid is like winning the lottery so long as you don't aggro him. Before you used to be able to man-handle any bot by harassing with a ranged ability so they would back off immediately instead of farming. This made all heroes back off, regardless of how strong they actually are early game. I've noticed that's not the case anymore. Lina isn't too strong until she hits level 6, so I might advise getting someone to gank her to get an advantage. Bane is the bane of the bots though, you have to be really careful, but it should prepare you for Bane in Matchmaking.
              This ain't ova.

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