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Nyx Impale still triggering Linken's after the 6.79

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  • Nyx Impale still triggering Linken's after the 6.79

    Made a thread in the Critical Test Client Bugs forum before it went live, but it was either not deemed critical enough or is intended (in which case clarification would be appreciated).

    I'm fully aware that old Impale was included in this intended change, but this applies to skills which can be both Ground or Unit targeted, triggering Linken's regardless of the targeting mode (unlike WC3 DotA where it apparently only triggered when unit targeted).

    With the removal of the unit targeting from Nyx' Impale, the Linken's interaction (and inclusion in the above mentioned intended change) should also be removed to be more in line with the other ground target only skillshot/disables like Ice Path, Split Earth or LSA.

    WC3 Behaviour: Still unknown until the 6.79 map is released, but I would expect it to not trigger Linken's.
    Last edited by zergl; 10-22-2013, 02:06 AM.

  • #2
    i agree

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    • #3
      must agree

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      • #4
        Still not fixed? Damn...

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        • #5
          If you follow this logic, then lots of other skills should get blocked, too..

          Duel Breath, Ice Path, Sonic Wave, Shockwave, Carrion Swarm and many more. All of them are unit and point target, just like Fissure.
          Please, just call me buny.

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          • #6
            debatable topic. maybe should let icefrog or valve devs answer this, so we dont have to repeat it again and again.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Eric37073 View Post
              debatable topic. maybe should let icefrog or valve devs answer this, so we dont have to repeat it again and again.
              Why? There is nothing to discuss, if the new Impale should be blocked then Sunstrike should too. Bottomline is that they are only ground targetable, and should not interact with Linken.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by posnisir View Post
                Why? There is nothing to discuss, if the new Impale should be blocked then Sunstrike should too. Bottomline is that they are only ground targetable, and should not interact with Linken.
                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...ll=1#post14272

                this is the "problem" :P
                If you find spelling errors, you are free to take them.

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                • #9
                  Did you even read that thread? That is about spells that are unit AND ground targetable. The change is that those spells are blocked even when you target the ground, unlike in DotA where people used that to avoid procing Linken. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH NYX IMPALE BECAUSE NOW IT'S ONLY GROUND TARGETABLE. This has been explained countless times but people still keep linking that response even though it's a completely different subject.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by posnisir View Post
                    Did you even read that thread? That is about spells that are unit AND ground targetable. The change is that those spells are blocked even when you target the ground, unlike in DotA where people used that to avoid procing Linken. THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH NYX IMPALE BECAUSE NOW IT'S ONLY GROUND TARGETABLE. This has been explained countless times but people still keep linking that response even though it's a completely different subject.
                    did you read what bunny said?
                    Originally posted by bu3ny View Post
                    If you follow this logic, then lots of other skills should get blocked, too..

                    Duel Breath, Ice Path, Sonic Wave, Shockwave, Carrion Swarm and many more. All of them are unit and point target, just like Fissure.
                    We will only know if either
                    a) icefrog tells use, what he thought about this
                    b) wc3 6.79 gets rel.

                    till than we can only assume how it should work
                    If you find spelling errors, you are free to take them.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jan2011 View Post
                      did you read what bunny said?
                      Well, my response is still the same-the thread you linked has nothing to do with this one.

                      As for what he said:well, there are a few spells that can be unit targeted but don't trigger Linkens, yes. However, Impale is the ONLY ground targetable that does, and that's because that part of the coding stayed the same as pre-patch.

                      There indeed may be a possibility that IF intended it, but I doubt that his new way of nerfing heroes is breaking the consistency (Oh, Sunstrike too strong? Let's make it break Linkens)

                      Edit: and yes, I agree we could use at least some response on this thread
                      Last edited by posnisir; 10-23-2013, 06:28 AM.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Jan2011 View Post
                        This is not a problem.

                        Icefrog stated that about impale/burrowstrike/etc because in Dota1 those were blocked by linken's when targeted on a hero and weren't when targeted on ground.

                        In dota2 those spells are always blocked. That's an intended change.

                        6.79 changes Nyx's impale targeting from "unit/ground-targeting" to "ground-targeting" so it's now like LSA/Ice path (even if you click it on a hero, Nyx won't turn after it. If you blink behind Nyx, he will stun ground".

                        There is no problem. There is nothing to discuss. It's a bug and Nyx's impale no longer has a standard impale mechanic.

                        Originally posted by bu3ny View Post
                        If you follow this logic, then lots of other skills should get blocked, too..

                        Duel Breath, Ice Path, Sonic Wave, Shockwave, Carrion Swarm and many more. All of them are unit and point target, just like Fissure.
                        These spells aren't unit/point targeted.

                        If you blink behind Jakiro casting ice path on you he will stun ground (because ice path doesn't have unit target mechanic)

                        If you blink behind earthshaker casting Fissure on you he will do a backfissure because this time he actually targets a unit and not ground (turns around after a unit)

                        Do you see the difference?

                        (I remember some spells having these parameters set wrong and having unit targeting, however. Was that sonic wave? That's a bug anyway)

                        Even that's not the main thing. Impale is now just an aoe spell without unit targeting. It shouldn't get blocked by linken's like the majority of aoe spells. LSA doesn't get blocked. Ice path doesn't get blocked. Nyx impale shouldn't.
                        Last edited by Caleb; 10-23-2013, 06:44 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Caleb View Post

                          These spells aren't unit/point targeted.

                          If you blink behind Jakiro casting ice path on you he will stun ground (because ice path doesn't have unit target mechanic)

                          If you blink behind earthshaker casting Fissure on you he will do a backfissure because this time he actually targets a unit and not ground (turns around after a unit)

                          Do you see the difference?

                          (I remember some spells having these parameters set wrong and having unit targeting, however. Was that sonic wave? That's a bug anyway)

                          Even that's not the main thing. Impale is now just an aoe spell without unit targeting. It shouldn't get blocked by linken's like the majority of aoe spells. LSA doesn't get blocked. Ice path doesn't get blocked. Nyx impale shouldn't.
                          Yea, figured Icepath is different since its changes. But still, Duel Breath and Sonic Wave etc are still point and unit target, which is not a bug. It's the same in DotA1, unless it got changed. They will get casted on you when you got targeted.
                          So if you want consistancy, then those should get blocked, too, and Nyx' Impale not.
                          Please, just call me buny.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jan2011 View Post
                            We will only know if either
                            a) icefrog tells use, what he thought about this
                            b) wc3 6.79 gets rel.

                            till than we can only assume how it should work
                            So for option B, we'll know how it's supposed to work when we can see how it works in another game? Why would Dota 1 get it right over Dota 2? Is Dota 1 tested more?

                            I know that Dota 1 has been considered the reference for how things work, but that was only for pre-existing skills and behavior. I don't see why this would be true for changes for new patches, though. If Dota 1 is always right for new behavior why not make Dota 2 correct as well? Answer: bugs could occur for either of them.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by bu3ny View Post
                              Yea, figured Icepath is different since its changes. But still, Duel Breath and Sonic Wave etc are still point and unit target, which is not a bug. It's the same in DotA1, unless it got changed. They will get casted on you when you got targeted.
                              So if you want consistancy, then those should get blocked, too, and Nyx' Impale not.
                              Well those are exceptions yes. (more to do with wc3 mechanics than balance)

                              But Impale would be a completely unique exception. Right now AoE abilities with unit targetting are half and half with linkens, generally stuns trigger it and nukes do not. AoE abilities without unit targeting never trigger linkens.

                              If linkens blocking impale is intended, there are basically no rules to which spells it blocks anymore. It might as well block Skywrath Mages ult, it's no different from impale - being an AoE ground target only.
                              ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Give TECHIES

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