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[Intended?] Shadow demon's disruption + shadow poison

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  • [Intended?] Shadow demon's disruption + shadow poison

    When shadow demon disrupts a unit and then casts shadow poison on him the poison is applied in dota 2, I confirmed in dota 1 that only soul catcher affects disrupted units. Which means shadow poison does not affect disrupted units. (I mean during the banish if u dont get it).

    I'm posting this here because I'm not sure if it's intentional in dota 2 or not.

    It's not a major issue, the only way to exploit this is by disrupting the unit and ensuring ur shadow poison hits.

  • #2
    I should have caught this from when SD first came out, there was a bug where poison stacked twice if you cast it on a disrupted unit. But now that I think about it, poison shouldn't be applied to a disrupted target at all.

    There's nothing in the original code that I can see that allows poison to stack on disrupted units, although the poison can damage them if already stacked. Someone confirm?
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    • #3
      on a similar note, detonating shadow poison damage and demonic purge ticking it's damage isn't amplified by soul catacher while disrupted. is this intended?

      Someone confirm?
      confirm the DotA interaction or confirm shadow poison hitting disrupted units? it most definitely does, and actually shadow poison stacks on the disrupted unit before the projectile even hits the disrupted unit, as long as the projectile is flying towards the unit, it connects as soon as the projectile is fired
      Last edited by vladhood; 04-18-2012, 02:31 AM.

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      • #4
        We'll come back to the soul catcher part later, but it should be amplified.

        I mean the Dota 1 interaction. Now that I've tried it, it actually doesn't work in D1.
        Always read and follow the forum rules. If you need help from a moderator, use the report button ()
        Before posting new bugs:
        -Check the Known Bugs List and search the forum for an existing report.
        -Make sure its a bug (test in WC3 Dota, visit playdota guides and adv. mech, etc). If you're still not sure, post in Mechanics and Gameplay Bug Brainstorming instead.
        -Read the Bug Posting Guidelines on how to report a bug properly.

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        • #5
          tbh, it just makes sense, that both spells affect the target during disruption. there was no necessity to make soul catcher affect the disrupted target either, it was just added for convenience. i think the same applies to shadow poison now.
          Last edited by blash365; 06-25-2012, 07:04 AM.
          Make sure to read the Forum Rules as well as the stickied Threads of the Forum Section you are posting in.

          Contributions i'd like to highlight:
          My Suggestion: Coaching System
          My Sticky: Intended Changes List
          My Challenge: Completely Fixed Hero Challenge: Skywrath Mage

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          • #6
            the issue is parity, not sense or whatever

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            • #7
              adding to intended fix list discussion.
              Make sure to read the Forum Rules as well as the stickied Threads of the Forum Section you are posting in.

              Contributions i'd like to highlight:
              My Suggestion: Coaching System
              My Sticky: Intended Changes List
              My Challenge: Completely Fixed Hero Challenge: Skywrath Mage

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              • #8
                I am not sure if this is not intented, there was fix some time ago alowing to make shadow poison damage in banish to prevent instant dagger blink.

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                • #9
                  I think this is intended and if I rember right the tooltip for sd says posion goes through distrubtion.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by vladhood View Post
                    the issue is parity, not sense or whatever
                    Sometimes, I can't help but wonder if removing all the nonsensical mechanics and interactions was one of the few things Riot got right.
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by DarkLite View Post
                      Sometimes, I can't help but wonder if removing all the nonsensical mechanics and interactions was one of the few things Riot got right.
                      Dota defintly needs to work on making things more consistent. Its to manya wierd and odd mechanics that just doesnt makes sense and shadow posion not going through banish is one of them. I would be glad if they all got remade so they make sense. Thinks like what Linken blocks should have a simple rule not big lists of exceptions.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by vladhood View Post
                        the issue is parity, not sense or whatever
                        the issue, in the end, is balance. parity is a sort-of kind-of more or less goal they're aiming at. if removing the quirkiness of an interaction affects balance in a quantifiable and positive way, they're going to do it. example: critting while phased.

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                        • #13
                          Yeah turns out that most of limitations of w3 engine was great to maintain balance in dota.

                          Or maybe dota1 was balanced because of w3 limitations, dota2 without that limitations turned out to be really imbalanced game.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by DarkLite View Post
                            Sometimes, I can't help but wonder if removing all the nonsensical mechanics and interactions was one of the few things Riot got right.
                            Those "nonsensical mechanics and interactions" are also known as the skill cap.

                            Originally posted by Isthore View Post
                            Or maybe dota1 was balanced because of w3 limitations, dota2 without that limitations turned out to be really imbalanced game.
                            This is Valve's fault for deviating from what worked. Luckily they can still revert most of their pointless changes (health bar segmentation, Rubick ult, orb stacking among the most obvious offenders). Does this make the game too hard to learn? Then add training videos and challenges like Starcraft 2 did.
                            Last edited by Enai Siaion; 07-19-2012, 05:05 AM.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Enai Siaion View Post
                              Those "nonsensical mechanics and interactions" are also known as the skill cap.
                              There's a difference between a genuine skill cap and pointless inconsistencies. Invoker is a good example of a hero that has a high skill cap without terrible mechanics. Having a vast number of non-obvious game mechanics that aren't explained anywhere has nothing to do with skill and everything to do with tedious memorization. Earthshaker's ult doesn't hit ethereal units. Is it physical damage? No. Does it say it doesn't hit them? No, and I can't think of any reason to assume it wouldn't hit them. Does the damage go through magic immunity? Some of it. Does it say so? No. Does Linkens block Fissure, Burrowstrike and Impale? Yes. Do those spells fall into the "targeted" category in the description? No. Do Venomancer's spells hit invisible units? No. Do they say so? No. Does Ghost Scepter free you from Ensnare? Yes. Does it say so? No. Does BKB purge all buffs when activated? Nope, just some of them. Can some of these buffs be reapplied while you're immune? Yes.

                              It doesn't make you a good player if you've learned a giant list of "buffs that are not purged by BKB". Non-obvious game mechanics should be made obvious ingame (check the Linken / BKB icons here, that's the sort of thing we need, plus one for Ghost Scepter), and pointlessly stupid things should be removed. An item like Linken should have one consistent rule ("blocks one targeted spell"), completely block one targeted spell and then go on cooldown.

                              This is Valve's fault for deviating from what worked. Luckily they can still revert most of their pointless changes (health bar segmentation, Rubick ult, orb stacking among the most obvious offenders). Does this make the game too hard to learn? Then add training videos and challenges like Starcraft 2 did.
                              I'm guessing you're one of those people who believe that ally mana bars and segmented health bars are the worst thing ever to happen to dota!!1?
                              Last edited by DarkLite; 07-19-2012, 06:59 AM.
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