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Yet another mismatch thread.

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  • Yet another mismatch thread.

    This has happened in basically every single game I've played since the "matchmaking update".
    I (someone with 850 games) am matched with people who have less than 300, such as the Riki in this game. Match id 249368661
    It was a Random Draft where he picked Riki after we already had Spirit Breaker, Elder Titan, and Tiny. That was when I knew he would feed and the game was over right then and there.
    He and his friend CM feed their safelane to all hell and back while I get two solo kills on the enemy Weaver as Spirit Breaker.
    If you like you can feel free to watch the match.
    Now please tell me I'm at the same skill level as Riki and should rightfully be matched with the likes of him.

  • #2
    You are the same skill level as riki and should rightfully be matched with the likes of him.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by DatOneBlackGuy View Post
      You are the same skill level as riki and should rightfully be matched with the likes of him.
      I have never seen anyone as clever or funny as you before. 10/10. Really contributing.

      Comment


      • #4
        I know how you feel, but keep in mind the newbs and volvo-fanboys have access to this forum too. Maybe they'll blame you for playing bad people, a system developed by valve obviously can't be bullshit.
        MEH

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by ConfusedCactus View Post
          This has happened in basically every single game I've played since the "matchmaking update".
          I (someone with 850 games) am matched with people who have less than 300, such as the Riki in this game. Match id 249368661
          It was a Random Draft where he picked Riki after we already had Spirit Breaker, Elder Titan, and Tiny. That was when I knew he would feed and the game was over right then and there.
          He and his friend CM feed their safelane to all hell and back while I get two solo kills on the enemy Weaver as Spirit Breaker.
          If you like you can feel free to watch the match.
          Now please tell me I'm at the same skill level as Riki and should rightfully be matched with the likes of him.
          It's nothing to do with win count. It's a Normal ranked match.

          No matter how many wins you have, if you're playing in Normal rank expect to be matched with players that make mistakes. Lots of them. Bad Picks. Bad Lanes. Bad skill builds. Bad item builds. Bad initiations. Bad positioning. Bad map awareness. Bad focus and most of all bad decisions about when to farm and when to push!

          There are many accounts with far fewer matches played than 850, playing at a much higher level.

          -----

          I watched the match. It wasn't anything particularly unusual. Just a bad tri-lane, with very few stacks and pulls, leaving them exposed and at lvl 4 while Lich and Bristle were lvl 8.

          The OP is Bara.

          0:00 It starts as a dual lane, with CM + Riki vs BB and Lich
          2:30 ET ports in, leaving Bara solo offlane, to make it a tri-lane
          2:57 ET is late for his first stack attempt
          3:10 CM places anti-gank wards for top lane.
          3:55 ET sucessfully stacks, leaving Riki and CM alone
          4:15 ET maks his first pull
          4:41 Safe lane is still very over extended. Riki dies to Goo, Quill and Frost Blast. CM has no mana to save him.
          4:45 CM tries to escape by buying a TP from the side shop, but doesn't have the mana to use it. ET is late to help and can't save her
          6:48 ET Makes his 2nd pull of the match, but has wasted a lot of health jungling hard camp.
          7:18 Siege creep, makes chain pull
          7:27 ET dies to Goo, Quill and Frost Blast while trying to farm pull camp on 30% HP.
          7:42 CM and ET try to help. CM kills BB, but to dies to his Quill.
          7:43 Riki dies to Frost Blast after trying to help ET.
          7:51 Tiny ganking from mid, gets there too late. Dies to Lich and Necro who followed him from mid.
          8:15 Bara charges top to make a kill on 25% HP Lich.
          8:40 Bara charges Necro, to make a kill, but Lich has already TP'ed back.
          8:50 lvl 4 Riki, lvl 4 CM, lvl 9 Bara, lvl 5 ET, die to Chain Frost, with Furi mopping up.
          14:40 Scores are 12-12. The game is far from lost.
          33:30 Bara starts raging in all-chat

          In the end, the match was lost to a 600 gpm Weaver and 750 gpm Furi, who were left to free-farm too long.

          Final Losing team hero dmg

          SB 10136
          ET 20506
          Tiny 18946
          Riki 5300
          CM 11321

          -----

          In summary, I'd say that the late decision to switch to a tri-lane was probably the biggest problem on that lane. Whose idea was it? Was is a gambit to get Bara fast XP? Going late, put him at a disadvantage, but I'd say that ET failed in his role, on that lane, more than CM or Riki, but in the end he was the team's most effective player.

          On hero dmg, the CM was, in the end, more effective than the OP.
          Last edited by Craig; 07-21-2013, 10:30 PM.
          To avoid LPQ:

          Don't draw attention to yourself
          Don't use voice or chat except for 'ss'
          Mute all at lvl 1
          Only play in parties
          Get alternate accounts
          Limit your usage to one or two games per day per account
          Don't play too well
          Don't play on Sunday or Monday
          Wait until the developers reset LPQ status

          If you're getting matched with trolls or feeders:

          You may have been placed in a hidden pool. There is no known way out of this, apart from moving to a different account.

          Comment


          • #6
            ^ Amen

            Comment


            • #7
              I haven't seen a dunking that hard in years.

              Comment


              • #8
                OP fucking crushed by Craig.

                10,000 damage done with Spirit Breaker in 40 minutes? 84 cs in 40 minutes? Less than Crystal fucking Maiden???? You all belonged together, bro.

                You are what I fear in pubs: the guy who picks a carry (like Spirit Breaker) that gets too carried away trying to gank and forgets that the hero needs fucking farm to compete mid and late game. All you had to show for your 40 minutes of time spent in that match on a carry was (1) treads, (2) bkb, and (3) urn. Those are 22-minute items on Bara. 84 cs is how much you should have had around 20 minutes. You didn't even seem to consider buying an attack speed item (like a mjollnir), nor an armor item (like an AC). You were too busy either raging or running from one side of the map to the other trying to gank. You for damn sure weren't trying to farm.

                For that matter, neither was Riki with his 46cs. But that's the trap so many Riki/SB/Huskar/Viper/Drow players fall into: once you hit 6, you think it's time to perma-gank. Fuck a creep, it's time to kill heroes. No, you need to farm. If you just want to perma-gank, pick Bounty Hunter or Ogre or Venge or some such. If you're going to pick a carry and take all the early farm, that early farming needs to build into mid and late-game items. Let the kills come to you, but don't force them. Don't hang around towers waiting for the other team to push: you need to farm. Don't walk around aimlessly from one side of the map to the other: you need to farm.

                If you don't farm as the carries on your team, you *will* get outcarried. There's not mystical concept to grasp here. You don't farm, you don't carry. And to top it all off, flaming in all-chat as if your shit didn't stink. If you had shown us you had a mjollnir, AC, Daedalus and BKB and your teammates did that poorly, I would have been on your side. You would have done all you could to carry scrubs across the finish line. But no, you were all equally bad.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Dreams-Visions View Post
                  OP fucking crushed by Craig.

                  10,000 damage done with Spirit Breaker in 40 minutes? 84 cs in 40 minutes? Less than Crystal fucking Maiden???? You all belonged together, bro.

                  You are what I fear in pubs: the guy who picks a carry (like Spirit Breaker) that gets too carried away trying to gank and forgets that the hero needs fucking farm to compete mid and late game. All you had to show for your 40 minutes of time spent in that match on a carry was (1) treads, (2) bkb, and (3) urn. Those are 22-minute items on Bara. 84 cs is how much you should have had around 20 minutes. You didn't even seem to consider buying an attack speed item (like a mjollnir), nor an armor item (like an AC). You were too busy either raging or running from one side of the map to the other trying to gank. You for damn sure weren't trying to farm.

                  For that matter, neither was Riki with his 46cs. But that's the trap so many Riki/SB/Huskar/Viper/Drow players fall into: once you hit 6, you think it's time to perma-gank. Fuck a creep, it's time to kill heroes. No, you need to farm. If you just want to perma-gank, pick Bounty Hunter or Ogre or Venge or some such. If you're going to pick a carry and take all the early farm, that early farming needs to build into mid and late-game items. Let the kills come to you, but don't force them. Don't hang around towers waiting for the other team to push: you need to farm. Don't walk around aimlessly from one side of the map to the other: you need to farm.

                  If you don't farm as the carries on your team, you *will* get outcarried. There's not mystical concept to grasp here. You don't farm, you don't carry. And to top it all off, flaming in all-chat as if your shit didn't stink. If you had shown us you had a mjollnir, AC, Daedalus and BKB and your teammates did that poorly, I would have been on your side. You would have done all you could to carry scrubs across the finish line. But no, you were all equally bad.
                  >spirit breaker as a carry >.>

                  Since when?

                  :P. Honestly, I think SB is pretty good as a permaganker once he hits 6, but only every time his ult is up

                  It just shows how bad most players are at managing time, if you're not farming on your ganking downtime, you're gonna lose

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Shaella View Post
                    >spirit breaker as a carry >.>

                    Since when?

                    :P. Honestly, I think SB is pretty good as a permaganker once he hits 6, but only every time his ult is up

                    It just shows how bad most players are at managing time, if you're not farming on your ganking downtime, you're gonna lose
                    He's a fine ganker, yes. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise. But there's a difference between ganking and wandering. I don't know how else to say it, but everyone has done it. You look up at 30 minutes and realize you don't have any items and are wondering where the time went. Well chances are you:

                    1.) Wasted time walking from lane to lane instead of carrying a tp

                    2.) You didn't buy any farming items (battlefury/maelstrom/vanguard/armlet/perseverance) if you don't have some sort of passive aoe

                    3.) You sat around for minutes waiting for a team to push a tower you're ready to defend (or waiting to try to push a tower yourselves)

                    4.) You kept trading your life for someone you decided to gank.

                    5.) You never stopped by the ancients and never had anyone stack them (or stack them yourself)

                    6.) You spent time walking around the jungles looking for someone to gank and not finding much. Maybe waiting for a lane to push so you can get the drop on someone...except it never pushed.

                    Some combination of the above usually does it. Boom, tons of lost XP and gold.

                    This is how I play Bara

                    http://dotabuff.com/players/84310564...atch_type=real

                    to reasonable success (~500gpm, mostly winning). Not the best, but I've only played him a few times in life. Trick is simply to not get carried away with ganks. Take the opportunities when they come...and as you said, farm in the downtime. Farm hard.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      bumped for entertainment purposes.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Craig View Post
                        wall of text
                        Good review, man.

                        Also, I had a match some hours ago that I really think that was kind of unbalanced (needless to say I'm the Nyx, vide nickname) and I'd like some review before "HARR UNBALANCED GAEM DED GAEM": http://dotabuff.com/matches/249519083

                        The QoP didn't do nothing about harassing the SF, which is a big mistake. Even though the SB - which was a good player, to be honest - engaged some ganks to lowball him, I don't recall if any had success. Huskar was also a good one, and I had to solo with him for a couple time for unknown reasons - Pudge was afk in the tower for some moments. A gank attempt to Furion failed as I said "let me stun first, then you hook", but I don't think he listened. Nonetheless, the Pudge did well. No complains about the Silencer, and I believe I did some mistakes, e.g. when I tried to gank Silencer while I was warding. The next thing I know, they gathered and used dust when I tried to run - good thing I didn't ward there.

                        Actually, the problem was the Furion. He was just a goldbag, waiting for us to teleport and give us some for free. He was 0/17 until Juggernaut threw himself to their base for entertainment purposes, and somehow it scored a kill to him. Aside from that, he didn't do nothing good at all, and in the late game he trapped the SB twice into the Sprout. I don't really think he should be matched among us, as I believe the game would be far more competitive had they had another player.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Metan View Post
                          Good review, man.

                          Also, I had a match some hours ago that I really think that was kind of unbalanced (needless to say I'm the Nyx, vide nickname) and I'd like some review before "HARR UNBALANCED GAEM DED GAEM": http://dotabuff.com/matches/249519083

                          The QoP didn't do nothing about harassing the SF, which is a big mistake. Even though the SB - which was a good player, to be honest - engaged some ganks to lowball him, I don't recall if any had success. Huskar was also a good one, and I had to solo with him for a couple time for unknown reasons - Pudge was afk in the tower for some moments. A gank attempt to Furion failed as I said "let me stun first, then you hook", but I don't think he listened. Nonetheless, the Pudge did well. No complains about the Silencer, and I believe I did some mistakes, e.g. when I tried to gank Silencer while I was warding. The next thing I know, they gathered and used dust when I tried to run - good thing I didn't ward there.

                          Actually, the problem was the Furion. He was just a goldbag, waiting for us to teleport and give us some for free. He was 0/17 until Juggernaut threw himself to their base for entertainment purposes, and somehow it scored a kill to him. Aside from that, he didn't do nothing good at all, and in the late game he trapped the SB twice into the Sprout. I don't really think he should be matched among us, as I believe the game would be far more competitive had they had another player.
                          I can take a look later, but I can tell you straight away that the QoP was partied with the Bara, the two players that you mention as bad and good, respectively, so there could be a big skill difference in the match. If there is, those matches are just crazy. They often turn into a competition between opposing high skill players, while the others just mill around waiting to die. If one of the high skill players, picks badly, gets counterpicked, gets ganked hard or focussed well, then they can turn into stomps very easily.

                          If you were a solo player, get the hell out of regular matchmaking and play Solo Queue only.
                          Last edited by Craig; 07-22-2013, 01:41 PM.
                          To avoid LPQ:

                          Don't draw attention to yourself
                          Don't use voice or chat except for 'ss'
                          Mute all at lvl 1
                          Only play in parties
                          Get alternate accounts
                          Limit your usage to one or two games per day per account
                          Don't play too well
                          Don't play on Sunday or Monday
                          Wait until the developers reset LPQ status

                          If you're getting matched with trolls or feeders:

                          You may have been placed in a hidden pool. There is no known way out of this, apart from moving to a different account.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Craig View Post
                            I can take a look later, but I can tell you straight away that the QoP was partied with the Bara, the two players that you mention as bad and good, respectively, so there could be a big skill difference in the match. If there is, those matches are just crazy. They often turn into a competition between opposing high skill players, while the others just mill around waiting to die.
                            Yes, I was taking a look at their dotabuff accounts and they are friends. According to the SF, the QoP didn't even try to harass with Shadow Strike or deny properly his creeps, and I couldn't help but facepalm when I saw Huskar with a freaking Vanguard.

                            Now that I remember, I did put a ward between T1 and T2 tower that wasn't well positioned at all, I think.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Metan View Post
                              Yes, I was taking a look at their dotabuff accounts and they are friends. According to the SF, the QoP didn't even try to harass with Shadow Strike or deny properly his creeps, and I couldn't help but facepalm when I saw Huskar with a freaking Vanguard.

                              Now that I remember, I did put a ward between T1 and T2 tower that wasn't well positioned at all, I think.
                              Ok, I'm not even going to watch it,

                              These are the win and loss stats for the players with shared profiles

                              Radiant
                              -------

                              +26: Nyx 216 - 190
                              -1: Pydge 544 - 545 | Partied
                              -25: SF 798 - 823 | Partied

                              Dire
                              ----

                              +12: SB 328 - 316 | Partied
                              -5: QoP 140 - 145 | Partied

                              It looks likely that QoP and SF were some of the lowest ranked players, partied with the SB and Pudge as higher ranked friends. You were probably thrown into the game to even the teams. My feeling is the the SF has probably got a lower rank than his ability level, probably by trashing his rank by messing about too much, but was more than capable of dominating vs an easy opponent.

                              ---------------

                              Ok, I watched the start. Both mid builds are a little off, I'd say, but QoP's was by far the worst.

                              SF went 4 branches and tangoes for bottle rush, with DQQDQDQD (Even though he constantly had maxed souls, though he did kill QoP with Raze, so who am I to judge?)
                              QoP took what looks like suggested items and went WEEWQ (she's almost certainly very new to playing QoP)

                              SF won the early last hit battle, with 42 starting AD, to QoPs 58 and it was clear that SF understood that mid pairing a lot better than QoP.

                              QoP lost the walking courier to SF with her boots in it, due to not paying attention to the pathing after Furi rerouted it through the jungle. She didn't seem interested in getting a bottle.

                              The team didn't do much to help. SF is one of those heroes that should be ganked in mid. Bara and Husk had a look after QoP died the first time but didn't quite coordinate their gank well. Furi tried. I have no idea why, but just fed him more.

                              Furi played much worse than the QoP. It looks like he randomed, then Treant-jungled without Clarity. His 9 min lvl 6, 15 min buyback for a badly placed TP and 23 min Orchid as first item, certainly didn't do the team any favours. In fact his TPs throughout the game were mostly suicidal and he certainly trolled teammates with Sprout.
                              Last edited by Craig; 07-22-2013, 03:30 PM.
                              To avoid LPQ:

                              Don't draw attention to yourself
                              Don't use voice or chat except for 'ss'
                              Mute all at lvl 1
                              Only play in parties
                              Get alternate accounts
                              Limit your usage to one or two games per day per account
                              Don't play too well
                              Don't play on Sunday or Monday
                              Wait until the developers reset LPQ status

                              If you're getting matched with trolls or feeders:

                              You may have been placed in a hidden pool. There is no known way out of this, apart from moving to a different account.

                              Comment

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