Announcement

Collapse

Forum Rules

  • No flaming or derogatory remarks, directly or through insinuation.
  • No discussion, sharing or referencing illegal software such as hacks, keygen, cracks and pirated software.
  • No offensive contents, including but not limited to, racism, gore or pornography.
  • No excessive spam/meme, i.e. copious one liners in a short period of time, typing with all caps or posting meme responses (text/image).
  • No trolling, including but not limited to, flame incitation, user provocation or false information distribution.
  • No link spamming or signature advertisements for content not specific to Dota 2.
  • No Dota 2 key requests, sell, trade etc.
  • You may not create multiple accounts for any purpose, including ban evasion, unless expressly permitted by a moderator.

  • Please search before posting. One thread per issue. Do not create another thread if there is an existing one already.
  • Before posting anything, make sure you check out all sticky threads (e.g., this). Do not create new threads about closed ones.
  • It is extremely important that you post in correct forum section.

  • Balance discussion only in Misc.
  • All art related (such as hero model) feedbacks go to Art Feedback Forum.
  • All matchmaking feedback should go here: Matchmaking Feedback
  • All report/low priority issues should go here: Commend/Report/Ban Feedback
  • No specific workshop item feedback. These should go to workshop page of that item.
  • When posting in non-bugs section (such as this), use [Bugs], [Discussion] or [Suggestion] prefix in your thread name.



In case you object some action by a moderator, please contact him directly through PM and explain your concerns politely. If you are still unable to resolve the issue, contact an administrator. Do not drag these issues in public.



All rules are meant to augment common sense, please use them when not conflicted with aforementioned policies.
See more
See less

Community and Developer Relations

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Community and Developer Relations

    might be interesting reading given the number of rants about valve in this forum and provide some context about the appropriate attitude to keep on these forums.

    you can feel free to disagree, but it did make me feel bad to imagine some introverted developers eagerly toiling away at the three spirits update, missing the deadline because of work overload, and having the internet scream at them about diretide. the post's comment on threats against developers actually brings to mind the cyborgmatt incident.

    http://kotaku.com/i-help-make-video-...fro-1500603631

  • #2
    realy nice read. Thanks for sharing this ^^
    If you find spelling errors, you are free to take them.

    Comment


    • #3
      Blog poster is irritating. Pretty much whine post


      Also many people do understand the amount of work that is put in. But that is no excuse of crap material (not that I'm condoning random nonconstructive hatred). However the blog poster despite saying "Criticism is a good thing" (Constructive) he then whines about how all the work he put it means "Criticism will crush his soul" "Its a bad thing" "It makes him want to quit", waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

      -->If you spend hours and produce buggy crap, then that it is valid to state it is buggy crap.
      -->If you spend hours and make a lazy game (The COD franchise has some lazy games, since some are just remodels of the old game, with slightly different variants) Then it can be called lazy, or unoriginal.


      etc
      Last edited by Crowfeather; 01-14-2014, 02:29 PM.
      Originally posted by Typhox
      Nope. Windows Explorer is not a database
      Take a look into the mirror! You think you are completely unfailable. With your limited knowledge, you think that you know more than someone who is very deep in the matter/an expert.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Crowfeather View Post
        Blog poster is irritating. Pretty much whine post
        The same thing can be said about 90% of closed threads.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Heh_ View Post
          The same thing can be said about 90% of closed threads.
          I'd say 80% since a lot of closed threads are bug reports. That are fixed or false, usually less of whine and just bad reporting?
          Originally posted by Typhox
          Nope. Windows Explorer is not a database
          Take a look into the mirror! You think you are completely unfailable. With your limited knowledge, you think that you know more than someone who is very deep in the matter/an expert.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Crowfeather View Post
            I'd say 80% since a lot of closed threads are bug reports. That are fixed or false, usually less of whine and just bad reporting?
            Okay, 90% of closed threads in the community section are bad whine threads.

            Comment


            • #7
              Also many people do understand the amount of work that is put in. But that is no excuse of crap material (not that I'm condoning random nonconstructive hatred). However the blog poster despite saying "Criticism is a good thing" (Constructive) he then whines about how all the work he put it means "Criticism will crush his soul" "Its a bad thing" "It makes him want to quit", waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
              Criticism =!= go kill yourself.
              つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Solo Queue

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Heh_ View Post
                Okay, 90% of closed threads in the community section are bad whine threads.
                Agreed ^^

                Originally posted by Kumori View Post
                Criticism =!= go kill yourself.
                You didn't read my post -->
                Originally posted by Typhox
                Nope. Windows Explorer is not a database
                Take a look into the mirror! You think you are completely unfailable. With your limited knowledge, you think that you know more than someone who is very deep in the matter/an expert.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Good read, sadly game dev industry lost lot of respect over the long years.

                  Games are less creative, are more surefire hits. Marketing guys are really burying it, and you are supposed to pay upfront for a product, imagine how would the market work if player would pay after he enjoyed the product, maybe based on his means, and not even has to but he wants to support the devs, and in those cases when you trust them you can pay upfront like kickstarter.

                  When it comes to AAA titles it has the work of a lot of people in it and it must succeed, but it often comes down to one thing, they far oversell it compared to what they actually deliver and people are tricked into buying it and they are disappointed.

                  Sadly many aspiring game devs join the ranks of these titles and end up not finding what they are looking for, unless they truly joined the one of the precious few, they will find themselves making boring games that should suffice those who are new to gaming, and never try to do something actually worthwhile, if not for the improving graphics they would have a hard time making up an excuse to make most games.

                  This is not unique, tv is full of cop shows and medical dramas, same films get remade constantly, books are still cool, and games have a real chance with indie titles and even few mils can cover a bigger one, and big titles doesn't have to suck, few of them are amazing.

                  How many games do people have in their steam library that they have actually played through or played like 20 h with it, what if they would only pay for those ? Marketing guys would be mostly gone because it would not be about scamming people but about giving them quality.
                  Last edited by nadaga; 01-15-2014, 12:07 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Ehm... damn. I whish I knew english as good as my first cuz what i whant to say is just bit complicated, uhg ok lets' try at least..

                    Ofc, as every humand being that anonymous developer is right - no one deserves such treatment regardless any reason. But...

                    In case of Valve, I'll say they deserve some of the beating.

                    Lets see what Valve employee says here http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2014...communication/ when that guy Nathan says they need to communiacte more with theirs customer. Valves just respond like "No we dont". "But they need to know what you doing?". "No they dont", again... They just ignore the questions, arguments.. everything! They know better! What a crippled logic. They ingore even journalist in the face of all their customers... millions of people! You know.. thats just way too much.

                    In western countries with well developed capitalism it's called "bad customer service" for certain. In mother Russia we have another word for such behavior - "sovok", it comes from "Soviet Union" and a very common situation in a soviet empire of government's capitalism where any service industry employee would just expected to not give a shit about customers. And it was logical because his salary, his employment was not dependent on company revenue or quality of his work. nothing was dependent on it because his employer was soviet government, everyone's employer was soviet government, that means - no concurency, no market, no natural motivations to be better than others on the market because there was no "others". It was umpleasant but expectend and almost "Okay". But Valve... i have no other words just outrage. Personally as a man born in USSR I expected better from capitalistic enterprise you know.

                    If ther listen and at least fix this it alone would sove half of their problems with audience. But given their recruiting rulers and how things work at Valve i guess they wont. There're only developers at valve, technical specialists - no public relation guys, no marketeers. Or at least very few of them... So there is just nearly nobody who can listen and respond. And what have community left if their beloved developer don't give a damn about them? (ok I understand they care but the situation looks like they really dont give a shit) Metacritic riot, screaming, whining, turning aside... whatever. And you know? that diretide metacritic riot just worked! The only thing worket and it was violent, wrethched, bloody. The ONLY THING WORKED, just think about it. Valve's logic just beyond any comprehension, beyond any reason. They ignore - people act accordingly. just this, nothing more.

                    upd. about valve and iwhy it doesnt respond to customers needs - I think their market size (way too large... large companies tend to be less harmed by customers discontent usually) and a very soft inner environment (all that "horizontal" management aproaches) results in more lowered dependance on what audience think or need, which bring em nearly on soviet's customer service standarts in some aspects of their work.
                    Last edited by hrlt; 01-14-2014, 04:00 PM.
                    Everything you wanna know 'bout Russia http://wtfrussia.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by hrlt View Post
                      Ehm... damn. I whish I knew english as good as my first cuz what i whant to say is just bit complicated, uhg ok lets' try at least..

                      Ofc, as every humand being that anonymous developer is right - no one deserves such treatment regardless any reason. But...

                      In case of Valve, I'll say they deserve some of the beating.

                      Lets see what Valve employee says here http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2014...communication/ when that guy Nathan says they need to communiacte more with theirs customer. Valves just respond like "No we dont". "But they need to know what you doing?". "No they dont", again... They just ignore the questions, arguments.. everything! They know better! What a crippled logic. They ingore even journalist in the face of all their customers... millions of people! You know.. thats just way too much.

                      In western countries with well developed capitalism it's called "bad customer service" for certain. In mother Russia we have another word for such behavior - "sovok", it comes from "Soviet Union" and a very common situation in a soviet empire of government's capitalism where any service industry employee would just expected to not give a shit about customers. And it was logical because his salary, his employment was not dependent on company revenue or quality of his work. nothing was dependent on it because his employer was soviet government, everyone's employer was soviet government, that means - no concurency, no market, no natural motivations to be better than others on the market because there was no "others". It was umpleasant but expectend and almost "Okay". But Valve... i have no other words just outrage. Personally as a man born in USSR I expected better from capitalistic enterprise you know.

                      If ther listen and at least fix this it alone would sove half of their problems with audience. But given their recruiting rulers and how things work at Valve i guess they wont. There're only developers at valve, technical specialists - no public relation guys, no marketeers. Or at least very few of them... So there is just nearly nobody who can listen and respond. And what have community left if their beloved developer don't give a damn about them? (ok I understand they care but the situation looks like they really dont give a shit) Metacritic riot, screaming, whining, turning aside... whatever. And you know? that diretide metacritic riot just worked! The only thing worket and it was violent, wrethched, bloody. The ONLY THING WORKED, just think about it. Valve's logic just beyond any comprehension, beyond any reason. They ignore - people act accordingly. just this, nothing more.

                      upd. about valve and iwhy it doesnt respond to customers needs - I think their market size (way too large... large companies tend to be less harmed by customers discontent usually) and a very soft inner environment (all that "horizontal" management aproaches) results in more lowered dependance on what audience think or need, which bring em nearly on soviet's customer service standarts in some aspects of their work.

                      Well said. Games like DotA need a dedicated PR department and constant effort put by devs/managers. Valve do not understand that this game is not a shooter. I've learned to expect nothing from these greedy pigs.
                      https://soundcloud.com/blinkingriki182

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        bro the game is available to you free of charge

                        the quality of the game is better than some games you pay for

                        if you want this game to be picture perfect, then how about you go employ the workers you think will better suit the game and pay out of ur own pockets for this free game

                        ( whats the bet half of you are unemployed and can't even afford 10thousand bucks lul )

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by BlinkingRiki182 View Post
                          Well said. Games like DotA need a dedicated PR department and constant effort put by devs/managers. Valve do not understand that this game is not a shooter. I've learned to expect nothing from these greedy pigs.
                          They don't have PR because they don't see that as a valuable skill. You may see it, but they want more technical people.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by ThreeDonkeys View Post
                            They don't have PR because they don't see that as a valuable skill. You may see it, but they want more technical people.
                            Some technical ppl dude. Especially the ones that implemented the mute system. When it was first implemented, it was possible to get a mute extension while you were muted. That shows very clear what kind of geniuses work for this company. The same geniuses can't implement 15 heroes in 2 years. It's just sad.
                            https://soundcloud.com/blinkingriki182

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              the mute system only agitates the shit players and the ones that wanna tell the team the great theory they have in mind, with no skill to back it up

                              trolololol

                              mute has never bothered me, mmr has worked good for me

                              SUPPP

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X