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My observations about the recent low priority punishment

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  • My observations about the recent low priority punishment

    Let me get 1 thing out of the way- Im not affected by the cowardly miserable low priority punishment system in place. Here I will just tell you why the current low priority punishment is sort of a double standard thing from Valve, basically another pathetic experiment they will have to change sooner rather than later.

    Incase you didnt know the recent LPQ punishment puts you in special game mode called "Single Draft" where you have 3 heroes to pick from. And now only wins count towards your 5 low priority games, that means if you dont win, you have to play as long as you win 5 games.

    To get another thing out of the way- it took me 6 games to finish LPQ. But here are my observations though:

    1) the MMR balancing doesnt really work there or its just not implemented, I had 2.2k players and 5.2k players in those games (which werent even in a party), granted I played at a somewhat unorthodox time and the later it gets, the wider the MMR spread becomes. What that means is, most games if not every game was a 1-sided stomp, if you thought balanced games are pretty rare in ranked All-Pick let alone unranked AP, well Single-Draft is just a huge fkn mess in terms of even matches.

    So let me explain something else about point #1- after the games, I actually went through ppls profiles to check how long they were playing in LPQ already. And most of the lower MMR players, especially below 3K MMR (which you can see MMR in most ppls profiles now) they were on their 10th-15th game already in LPQ.

    If you think that only trolls and griefers are in LPQ and deserve every single second of beeing there, well this is where you couldnt be more wrong. A TON of casual players end up in LPQ, because they are just playing occasionally and doing bad plays many times, even if its unranked All Pick, people will report them for playing bad, thats kinda logical. At least I would, doesnt matter if someones intentionally feeding 0-15 or a support player is stupid enough to go to place some wards or deward ALONE without any vision and gets killed 12 times in the process, to me its feeding either way so Id report that player.

    I know from a person in RL, that was new to Dota, liked to play carries like AM, BS, ended up in LPQ very often due to playing rather bad (clicking skills with mouse etc.). I mean he cooperated with the team etc. but in fights he was just bad and didnt manage alot. So he ended up in lpq ALOT, got discouraged by that eventually and stopped playing Dota alltogether.

    So to sum things up- the current LPQ punishment is the best way to make casual players hate the game and stop playing it. Good players with a big pool of heroes can leave LPQ relatively fast, while the unskilled casual ppl can stay for 15-20 games there easily, given that they only get offered 3 heroes to play, most of which they prolly suck with.

    As someone else mentioned on Reddit already: https://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/comme..._won_to_count/

    If you make only wins count towards your LPQ punishment, the most logical thing would be to let ppl actually play heroes they can play rather than some random heroes.

    All those people who get into lpq due to a rare occasional server bug, some rare connection issue on their side or some misplays, will stay in LPQ for an eternity, if they are rather new to the game. Basically the recent system punishes casual players hardest, and we all know Valve pretends to care about casual ppl, so this is why its a pathetic double standard with LPQ as Ive mentioned in the beginning.

    Now some ppl might jump in: "oh at least the casuals get to learn to play more heroes in Single-Draft", well it could work if the skill balance was properly implemented there, but as I wrote already- there basically is no skill balancing in that pool. How many ppl are in LPQ what do you think? 5-10% of players compared with other modes? We all know balanced games are super rare in real Ranked MM, you now can only imagine how stupidly idiotic the skill balance is in Single-Draft.


    So again- if youre a high skilled troll, feel free to troll everyone and do whatever you want in pubs, youll prolly need 5 to max. 8 games to leave LPQ. But if youre a rather mediocre player, you better make sure you dont do stupid mistakes with a high impact hero you picked, or youll find yourself in LPQ for lets say 10-20 games if things go wrong for you.

    2) making LPQ dependent from wins will allways harm the most "innocent" ppl amongst those who get into LPQ for whatever reason, which are the new players, the casual players, low MMR players etc. Essentially they will just give up after they get 2nd time into LPQ and will have to play for 10-20 games to get out of it.


    My suggestion to point #2 is this, yes Valve wanted to make something against those AFK jungle players and intential feeders in LPQ, but if they actually did put some thought into the "smart" punishment, rather than beeing some clueless overpayed trash Devs, they woulda given people 2 options to get out of LPQ---> either 4 wins or 10 games in total (win/loss combined). This is how you would encorage people to play normally to actually want to get out of LPQ as fast as possible.

    Reason I created this thread although im not directly affected by the system is, because I know some RL ppl who are new to Dota, the retarded community at lower MMR skill will report everyone who makes some mistakes even if its unranked All-Pick where people are allowed to learn new heroes, then the newcomers end up in LPQ and feel absolutely discouraged and trolled by the system in place.

    Shame on you you freaking humanly scum for beeing overpayed delusional so called developers, who only do things right when it either negatively affects themselves when they play and notice "oh wait, thats actually a completely stupid shit and shouldnt be like that" or when theres a social media riot.

    Many ppl say "oh the immature toxic Dota community.. this and that.." The thing is- the community is how the developers allow it to be. The community is not much different than the company behind this game, hiding their asses behind their workstations, never directly communicating with the community, punishing ppl in a pathetic way rather than encouraging and rewarding good behaviour, not investing any money in actually improving the social atmospehere in the game, hardly ever releasing new content- instead just overmilking their working cash-train concept with fucking compediums. Fall compendium fucking what? Cant take long before there will be a compendium for every month of the year.

    They will just throw shit onto the wall and see what sticks and what doesnt and then go with that. With their punishment systems in the past its evident theres a bunch of some immature "freshly studied" game design students behind this whole thing, completely delusional, non-social bunch of nerds who sit all day on Reddit, which is the only social experience in their life.

    Im just sorry for the new ppl who like the concept of the game and get hooked, because its a great community-made game, much like CS is, but its not because Valve did an amazing job creating those games, no- the fkn snobs just had the money to buy the concepts and milk those games to their needs, now they sit on the community-designed games and milk the money, without doing anything themselves. So the newcomers join, then notice how many retards are down there in 1-2k range which is where most new ppl will start, ppl will get insulted for not performing well with new heroes and reported down to LPQ (well because Valve will rather punish bad ppl in a retarded pathetic way than encourage and reward good behaviour, so basically noone gives a shit about beeing friendly/polite).

    This company gets more disgusting by the day.
    Last edited by WastedPenguinz; 12-29-2015, 05:02 AM.

  • #2
    I almost took it seriously till I got to the last few paragraphs. 8/10 for effort.
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    • #3
      If you disagree with something, feel free to provide counterarguments and then we will see what makes more sense.

      The Low Priority punishment as it is right now- it is, among some other things, mostly skill dependent as you get 3 random heroes of each attribute. If you have a higher skill, statistically you will rid your punishment way faster than some casual player who plays 2-3 games per week with same heroes.

      If this factor alone with skill wasnt enough, the matchmaking balance in Single-Draft doesnt exist. As I wrote already, I had some 2.1K players in the game searching solo, not in a stack even and I also had some 5.2k players in my Single-Draft games. Im a 4k player just for the record.

      So given those 2 things, for players below like 2.5k MMR, on average it will take 10-20 games in total to get rid of their punishment, which for a 4.5k+ player it will take 6-9 games on average. Then a question appears- shouldnt the punishment be exactly the same for everyone? Or are lower skilled players lesser human beeing in Valves eyes?

      That alone shows how delusional and clueless the developers are. They see one upvoted idea on Reddit by a bunch of 12 year olds and they fold like a card house for it, because they dont bother using their own brain how to make things better.

      And the thing is- they will realize it too that the current system is absolutely retarded to start with, once some Valve worker or someone who knows a Valve worker personally encounters a connection issue be it on their end or on Valves end, then lands in the LPQ and stays there for like 20 games untill they get out of there, this is when these clowns will realize what a dumb trash LPQ system they have now. Problem is, it might take a few more weeks/months untill they realize how retardedly stupid this system is. Valve is known for having a turtle reaction time to fix their mistakes.

      Again- the player numbers in LPQ are really low compared to normal mode, which automatically makes a fair matchmaking impossible, but then ON TOP of it, they are forcing ppl to play with random heroes. Its just a simple logical thing, that the less skilled players will require to play way more games on average, to get out of LPQ compared to higher skilled playes.

      What Valve does here is a variable punishment with several "classes" of player groups. The casuals will get punished harder than some lifeless Dota nerds, thats pure logic and Im sure the statistics would back it up too, if they actually ever cared to look into them.

      Its like arresting someone for driving too fast and then releasing them as soon as they can tell you 1 full page of Text about driving rules without any mistake. Younger ppl would come out after a day or two probably, while some older ppl would need weeks and ppl with bad short term memory prolly after years. I think with your whatever IQ you have, you should be able to understand the comparison I did there..
      Last edited by WastedPenguinz; 12-29-2015, 07:44 AM.

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      • #4
        I am one of the biggest haters of the current mmr system but I gotta admit folks this new Low Priority was one of the best things that EVER get fixed by Valve now they only have to fix another 3 billions things

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        • #5
          Originally posted by tales View Post
          I am one of the biggest haters of the current mmr system but I gotta admit folks this new Low Priority was one of the best things that EVER get fixed by Valve now they only have to fix another 3 billions things
          Oh really you do... Name 1 thing that is good about it. The fact that 2.1K players end up in games with 4.2k players maybe (each searching solo btw)? And on TOP of it, those lowskilled kids are forced to play a hero from a huge pool of 3 heroes in total?

          This is a variable punishment, that devastates the low skilled players most. Not to mention it has all sorts of bugs, like if someone leaves the game before it ends, the win wont count towards the winning team, like that game is lost time. I mean not that it is surprising to have problems in Dota 2, but it just adds up to the rest of the issues mentioned above.

          In other words- they arent even able do such trivial things like a socially correct punishment. The weaker players get punished more than some nerds that play Dota 24-7, is that fair?

          Yeah its truly a wonderful system, Mr. 12-posts kid. Go talk to some casual guy who received an abandonment due to Valve server issues, or someone who got reported for playing bad in a 1.8K unranked All-Pick game (get the irony with playing bad in 1.8K match?), and then ends up playing 20 LPQ games with some idiots. Go talk to those guys and explain to them how cool the new system is. I think though, your chances to get spit in the face would be really high doing so and well deserved too.
          Last edited by WastedPenguinz; 12-29-2015, 08:18 AM.

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          • #6
            I appreciate the effort you made trying to insult me there.
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            • #7
              Originally posted by J2Krauser View Post
              I appreciate the effort you made trying to insult me there.
              In the whole post there is a single sentence directed towards you, just a hint- its the first sentence. And by all means, I fail to see any signs of insult there. BUT, if that post made you feel kind of special and a little important, for a change in a very long time, then indulge in it, I dont mind.

              Edit: ok- mybe the last sentence too, but anyways- youre welcome.
              Last edited by WastedPenguinz; 12-29-2015, 08:25 AM.

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              • #8
                Thanks. By the way, no, I didn't actually feel special or important. I wonder, though, if you feel important enough to open a new thread for something that belongs in here: http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?t=23693
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                • #9
                  Originally posted by J2Krauser View Post
                  Thanks. By the way, no, I didn't actually feel special or important. I wonder, though, if you feel important enough to open a new thread for something that belongs in here: http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?t=23693
                  We all know thats just a garbage bin, where the only ppl who visit it, are truly anyone but devs themselves.

                  And we all know the only chance for devs to notice such a mess-up (if at all) is to make a separate thread about it. If you take a look at the chaos in the bug section, where hundreds of threads are posted in the wrong section, I think this thread is in most ppl's interest for the devs to notice it ASAP and perhaps correct the mistake, that by the way apparently was an idea of some Reddit kid, to make LPQ games only count if you win.

                  Well- generally not a bad idea, but not thought untill the end properly.

                  What we have right now is a variable punishment, mostly depending from a persons skill in this game. And if anyone should know anything about justice its that everyone should be treated equally. I mean, the chick with her eyes tied holding a pair of scales which are on the same level should be selfexplanatory, I would assume.
                  Last edited by WastedPenguinz; 12-29-2015, 08:36 AM.

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                  • #10
                    Game id :2035854087

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by WastedPenguinz View Post
                      We all know thats just a garbage bin, where the only ppl who visit it, are truly anyone but devs themselves.

                      And we all know the only chance for devs to notice such a mess-up (if at all) is to make a separate thread about it. If you take a look at the chaos in the bug section, where hundreds of threads are posted in the wrong section, I think this thread is in most ppl's interest for the devs to notice it ASAP and perhaps correct the mistake, that by the way apparently was an idea of some Reddit kid, to make LPQ games only count if you win.
                      You're not above the rules, so no, this is not the correct thing to do. The stickies were setup in interaction with Valve in the past, so either post in there or have your thread closed.
                      If you think I've closed or deleted a post unjustified, feel free to PM me and I'll explain it to you/discuss it with you further.

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