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If you choose to Solo Queue, matchmaking will punish you

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  • azrael109
    replied
    Originally posted by Paranoia14 View Post
    I know exactly how you feel and for some with 1.1k wins, it's ridiculous to be paired like that




    You sir, helped me with what I was trying to state, while the high wins players hate being paired with clueless ones. The low win ones who are still learning the game hate being against people who most definitely know far more than them.






    And you sound exactly like the kind of people who would make a trash matchmaking system. Oh and some info for you,
    1.) It's 49.47 which well, almost keeps with the contentious notion that MM will ensure you to be 48-52% more so if you solo queue.
    2.) Win rate is way worse a method of judging whom you should be paired with. I was partying with a friend, in the 46-47% win rate. He'd play support most games. So when he'd queue solo, he could only do so much as a support after which he'd have to rely on 4 other players to play their roles right and the guy is a brilliant support. He'll end his game with two bracers and brown boots if he really has to but he will make sure we have vision all game long.
    3.) Now, why wins matter...so some guy starts off dota, discovers RIKI. Starts stomping like mad and most times, he barely has an idea what the other heroes do, since as a riki you don't even need to in the early games. Matchmaking thinks he's too pro, matches him with better players and voila, the guy learns about dust, amplify damage, track, gem and even sentries for the first time and in the hard way. While his team is left getting frustrated and flaming the crap out of him.

    oh and the "You have a 49% win ratio so maybe you are as good as a 50 wins guy..." made me pmsl. Thank you for being so preposterous.
    There are lots of ppl who have played 1000 games, are at 40 something win % and are almost as bad as a totally new player. For solo MM elo would be a rather good way to match ppl (at last if you would bracket it), for teams it is horrible.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paranoia14
    replied
    Originally posted by SauloAqueiroz View Post
    look this match

    http://dotabuff.com/matches/250829726

    my team (35 wins ) - (54 wins )-(479 wins ) - (79 wins ) and me (1138 wins) ....

    The more games a player has, he has more experience, never a player with 2k + games will be worse than the other 100 games .. this is called experience of dota.
    After this update, the level of the games got worse, I played games with furion, who could not take a tower ... sven did not know take a lh.
    I know exactly how you feel and for some with 1.1k wins, it's ridiculous to be paired like that


    Originally posted by Groux View Post
    I am in a similar situation on the opposite end of the spectrum. I have about 65 wins, and I am continually teamed against people with 300+ wins. When I complain, the people in the match say "number of wins don't matter." Well, I call horse crap - as a game with nearly 120+ heroes takes a tremendous amount of time to learn them all, much less master them. I random nearly every time I play and I've still only played about 1/3rd of all of the heroes.

    Like you said, the more games you have played - the more experience you have. I am tremendously better at 65 wins (although still awful) than I was with 30 wins. I can only imagine where I'd be at 120, 250, 500, etc. In my opinion Valve really needs to give more weight to the number of wins and/or the number of total games in the matchmaking algorithms.
    You sir, helped me with what I was trying to state, while the high wins players hate being paired with clueless ones. The low win ones who are still learning the game hate being against people who most definitely know far more than them.




    Originally posted by YYZ, View Post
    IS NOT ABOUT THE NUMBER OF WINS.


    fuck.

    To the thread owner: man you have 700 wins but you also have 49% win ratio so may be you are as good as a 50 wins guy in the ELO system.
    And you sound exactly like the kind of people who would make a trash matchmaking system. Oh and some info for you,
    1.) It's 49.47 which well, almost keeps with the contentious notion that MM will ensure you to be 48-52% more so if you solo queue.
    2.) Win rate is way worse a method of judging whom you should be paired with. I was partying with a friend, in the 46-47% win rate. He'd play support most games. So when he'd queue solo, he could only do so much as a support after which he'd have to rely on 4 other players to play their roles right and the guy is a brilliant support. He'll end his game with two bracers and brown boots if he really has to but he will make sure we have vision all game long.
    3.) Now, why wins matter...so some guy starts off dota, discovers RIKI. Starts stomping like mad and most times, he barely has an idea what the other heroes do, since as a riki you don't even need to in the early games. Matchmaking thinks he's too pro, matches him with better players and voila, the guy learns about dust, amplify damage, track, gem and even sentries for the first time and in the hard way. While his team is left getting frustrated and flaming the crap out of him.

    oh and the "You have a 49% win ratio so maybe you are as good as a 50 wins guy..." made me pmsl. Thank you for being so preposterous.

    Leave a comment:


  • YYZ,
    replied
    IS NOT ABOUT THE NUMBER OF WINS.


    fuck.

    To the thread owner: man you have 700 wins but you also have 49% win ratio so may be you are as good as a 50 wins guy in the ELO system.

    Leave a comment:


  • Groux
    replied
    Originally posted by SauloAqueiroz View Post
    look this match

    http://dotabuff.com/matches/250829726

    my team (35 wins ) - (54 wins )-(479 wins ) - (79 wins ) and me (1138 wins) ....

    The more games a player has, he has more experience, never a player with 2k + games will be worse than the other 100 games .. this is called experience of dota.
    After this update, the level of the games got worse, I played games with furion, who could not take a tower ... sven did not know take a lh.
    I am in a similar situation on the opposite end of the spectrum. I have about 65 wins, and I am continually teamed against people with 300+ wins. When I complain, the people in the match say "number of wins don't matter." Well, I call horse crap - as a game with nearly 120+ heroes takes a tremendous amount of time to learn them all, much less master them. I random nearly every time I play and I've still only played about 1/3rd of all of the heroes.

    Like you said, the more games you have played - the more experience you have. I am tremendously better at 65 wins (although still awful) than I was with 30 wins. I can only imagine where I'd be at 120, 250, 500, etc. In my opinion Valve really needs to give more weight to the number of wins and/or the number of total games in the matchmaking algorithms.

    Leave a comment:


  • SauloAqueiroz
    replied
    look this match

    http://dotabuff.com/matches/250829726

    my team (35 wins ) - (54 wins )-(479 wins ) - (79 wins ) and me (1138 wins) ....

    The more games a player has, he has more experience, never a player with 2k + games will be worse than the other 100 games .. this is called experience of dota.
    After this update, the level of the games got worse, I played games with furion, who could not take a tower ... sven did not know take a lh.

    Leave a comment:


  • hontrash
    replied
    Same shit happens in MMR too.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paranoia14
    replied
    Originally posted by gattsu View Post
    Nice to see this thread ended up positively for every part. I also want to point out the benefits of Craig's behaviour. Specially from his patience, dedication to review games and keeping it civil at all time.
    He is rather patient, an extremely tough quality on forums especially. Although, I'd have appreciated it more if he could've seen it from my point of view before the blaming but nonetheless, he tries his best.



    Originally posted by Consural View Post
    Playing well has NOTHING to do with winning.Especially in a solo queue pub game.

    I have won games where I made a lot of mistakes,or farmed badly,or died continuously.I have lost games where I made big plays,had the perfect farm,and made minimal mistakes.

    Individual skill of one player comes to nothing when the other 4 are shit.
    Exactly what I believe. But then again, he has a point where he talks about how expressing yourself on the forum may hardly achieve too much.

    Leave a comment:


  • Consural
    replied
    Originally posted by klompf View Post
    After every game of mine (both won or lost) i can name a few mistakes i did, even when i won hard.
    Sometimes i think about a better solution, sometimes i browse a guide or ask a friend, sometimes i go practice a hero, watch how pro's play it or even run a practice i.e. to find better deward spots. The point is i NOTICE and ACKNOWLEDGE my mistakes as well as TRY TO LEARN/IMPROVE FROM THEM, and that my friend is the only way to play dota.

    So i have a friendly advice for you, instead of wasting your time with this desperate(?) post attempts that you r uber skillfull against the whole world of retards valve shitstorms you with. Spend half of that time actually improving, you'll be over 50% in no time.

    I am not trying to be rude nor am i saying that mm is flawless. It sucks as fuck, I get the same kind of retards every second game as you do (i just got used to it and live with it). Maybe it will get fixed maybe it won't, but the fact is there is no point in writing these walls of text none of the devs gives a fuck about its far more effective to spend it on anything else.

    Summary
    blaming retarded teammates -> no profit
    acknowledging your own mistakes instead -> improving

    cheers, hope i didnt offend you
    Playing well has NOTHING to do with winning.Especially in a solo queue pub game.

    I have won games where I made a lot of mistakes,or farmed badly,or died continuously.I have lost games where I made big plays,had the perfect farm,and made minimal mistakes.

    Individual skill of one player comes to nothing when the other 4 are shit.

    Leave a comment:


  • gattsu
    replied
    Nice to see this thread ended up positively for every part. I also want to point out the benefits of Craig's behaviour. Specially from his patience, dedication to review games and keeping it civil at all time.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paranoia14
    replied
    Originally posted by Shaella View Post
    I just read the title of this thread andOP's name

    literally nothing can be said to make this thread funnier
    Oh there's a lot I can think of, to tell you but I'll avoid
    Last edited by Paranoia14; 07-24-2013, 04:57 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shaella
    replied
    I just read the title of this thread andOP's name

    literally nothing can be said to make this thread funnier

    Leave a comment:


  • Paranoia14
    replied
    Originally posted by Craig View Post
    Winning streaks are not punished. It's all in your head.
    Unfortunately it's true oh and you know how easy it is to drop out of high mm? I was in high ever since the patch, got on a winning streak then wound up with the stupid TA. I had to go support nyx coz there was no support on the team. As a result I had a not so great k/d and next game, drop out of High. So the way I see it, K/D is all the matters and not whether or not you play your role. Next game, a shadow demon who calls mid, rushes a dagon (not even upgrades courier, let alone wards) and still farms in lane and never ganks. Tells us we need to farm up too (when the opposition is ganking away) Certainly makes you refrain from picking your usually good heroes unless you're with 3 or 4 friends.

    But on the bright side, at least their retarded brackets are explained to me now

    Leave a comment:


  • klompf
    replied
    After every game of mine (both won or lost) i can name a few mistakes i did, even when i won hard.
    Sometimes i think about a better solution, sometimes i browse a guide or ask a friend, sometimes i go practice a hero, watch how pro's play it or even run a practice i.e. to find better deward spots. The point is i NOTICE and ACKNOWLEDGE my mistakes as well as TRY TO LEARN/IMPROVE FROM THEM, and that my friend is the only way to play dota.

    So i have a friendly advice for you, instead of wasting your time with this desperate(?) post attempts that you r uber skillfull against the whole world of retards valve shitstorms you with. Spend half of that time actually improving, you'll be over 50% in no time.

    I am not trying to be rude nor am i saying that mm is flawless. It sucks as fuck, I get the same kind of retards every second game as you do (i just got used to it and live with it). Maybe it will get fixed maybe it won't, but the fact is there is no point in writing these walls of text none of the devs gives a fuck about its far more effective to spend it on anything else.

    Summary
    blaming retarded teammates -> no profit
    acknowledging your own mistakes instead -> improving

    cheers, hope i didnt offend you

    Leave a comment:


  • Craig
    replied
    Originally posted by Paranoia14 View Post
    Scratch whatever I said earlier. While the level of players has improved a slight bit. Winning streaks are still punished with poor level players. A TA who farms up all game and builds a deso. When there were already two desolators on my team. So I was in a 3 deso lineup. High bracket? Sure!
    Winning streaks are not punished. It's all in your head.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paranoia14
    replied
    Scratch whatever I said earlier. While the level of players has improved a slight bit. Winning streaks are still punished with poor level players. A TA who farms up all game and builds a deso. When there were already two desolators on my team. So I was in a 3 deso lineup. High bracket? Sure!

    Leave a comment:

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