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Dota 2 Cosmology - WIP

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  • post more lore lamprey, fuck. it's been a year and we're fiending.


    • Indeed, I can't wait to see the lore evolve. Lamprey, bring us more!


      • For everyone who thinks it's a good vs. evil thing, I just want to say is that the type of magic used is different from how it's applied.

        Lets say for an example there's a light mage who goes on killing sprees against the innocent on a daily basis. You wouldn't think that light mage is good would you? Another example would be a necromancer who uses dark magic to save other people's lives. You wouldn't think that necromancer is bad would you?

        Remember Shivering Isles from the ES series? Mania and Dementia are vastly different sides of the same island, Mania reflecting the more light, vibrant, and insane side while Dementia reflecting the more dark, dull, and depressing side. I used to be convinced that Mania was the good side. Well Radiant is to Mania as Dire is to Dementia. Radiant and Dire are both against each other because of their differences, but neither should be considered good nor evil.

        You wouldn't want that light mage who is also a spree killer as you friend, would you?
        Originally posted by malachiel
        playing dota2 is like going to a 3 star restaurant where you are seated in the restrooms.
        sig source


        • Here's my opinion on the lore;

          I think the heroes are corrupted by the Ancients similar to creeps but as the are "heroes" they have the willpower and strength of personality to maintain some sense of their identity. I would say that all heroes start unaligned from Dire or Radiant but their first contact with either substance corrupts them and binds the hero to the will of the Ancient. Another possibility is that the Ancients have a power similar to the Skill in Robin Hobb's Assassin trilogy which they use to overpower their minions and enslave them to their will. When an Ancient is destroyed it loses it's possession over the minds of it's heroes and creeps making them lose the will to fight and the opposing Ancient no longer senses their corruption and therefore doesn't see them as a threat. Also I think the player IS the Ancients, controlling the heroes, after all can't we see EVERYTHING our side sees?

          Also Faceless Void's and Spirit Breaker's law seems to suggest that there are other planes, and that the war of the ancients affects them somehow, possibly with the complete destruction of it if one side loses. That leaves me to believe that each separate plane possibly uses either Dire or Radiant substances exclusively and that the material plane where the war is fought is the only plane with both of the substances. Also on the topic of denying I think the best explanation is that the Ancients feel absolutely nothing for it's minions and that the opposing Ancient gains strength from their deaths. If you follow this train of thought experience might not actually be literal experience but instead it is the power of one Ancient as it loses its grip on a minion flowing to the nearest enemy heroes. However this thought line breaks down with neutral creeps, unless you assume that they have some of the Ancients power simply by being in close contact but have never been enthralled by either side.

          Someone asked what the runes were and the only thing I can think of is that the Ancients are suppressing, either intentionally or inadvertantly, some sort of natural magic or power that springs from the earth. That power springs forth where the Ancients power neutralizes themselves which stops either side from suppressing the "earth power".

          Anyway that's just what I think.


          • saw this in another thread, looks like a twisted unique way to explain why heroes fight for both sides.
            Originally posted by thyL View Post
            Okay, I have another theory that actually came to me in the shower after one of the worst and longest football matches of my life.
            When we play the game and destroy the Ancient building, we don't destroy the Ancient. In killing a strategically important building we win a battle, but not the war. Both, the Dire and the Radiant Ancients have the power to resurrect heroes (that's fairly obvious) and in every new battle they resurrect different ones and try out other combinations to win each battle. Always using the same line-up will obviously result in losing battle after battle, even when winning a couple at first. Yes, I'm saying all heroes are dead. They all died in the very first battle the Radiant and Dire fought out in this world, all the heroes that we categorize as belonging to the Radiant side fought for the Radiant, all the Dire heroes for the Dire. None of the heroes, not a single one, is mighty enough to actually put an end to an Ancient, even with the power of the other Ancient backing him up.
            They got tricked and deceived into this war by the Ancients and are now just the puppets on which strings the Ancients can pull if they want to. All the great history the heroes have is long gone past.
            ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ raise your hype ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ


            • So according to Cyborgmatt, this somewhat finished lore is in the pipeline.


              • I JUST saw this short little story.

                It wasn't bad. Interestingly written and all, my only critique of it is that there's a bit of word redundancy with "weird".


                • the heroes can play at both sides because of the -allpick mode, now everyone must remember in dota1 we need to input that command on the start of every game or we can only play the default heroes for sentinel or scourge.
                  -on lore-
                  want moaaaar
                  pwetty pweaaasee


                  • From my understanding of the moderator posts and the comic: "Are we Heroes yet?" it would appear that it is quite true that the "Demon Edge" is more than capable of corrupting any who touch it ((It is referenced before that they, the two bandits, were not the first to attempt to INTERACT(steal) the Demon Edge off.))

                    It is also very apparent that the Merchant, henceforce referred to as the "Keeper" is very much that. The keeper of the Demon Edge? Why? can friggin turn you into a creep! I am not sure how Roshan ties into this...I think that is something that should remain untouched, really. I think there is a lot to go off of based upon the comic that was realeased ((Excellent read btw.)) Let me list off what we "Know" and why I think it is important.

                    -- Demon Edge turns you into a creep -- get turned into a mindless game they continuously appear and attack the enemy base...mechanics yes...but in the comic it is very much a conflict that seems only to exist because they are two opposing 'sides'...yes I know that sounds obvious but think about what is actually happening. Thieves, Rogues, "Treasure Hunters", Heroes ((It was found in Roshan's lair, yes?)), not to mention anyone and anyone the Keeper has interacted with...If the keeper is setting up shop he clearly must have set up shop elsewhere! Who's to say he doesn't run shop in a popular town or city...if you saw a glowing blue badass sword wouldn't YOU WANT TO TOUCH IT? Bam! Frodo Baggins -- Except you're a creep and you get mowed down quickly...suddenly the idea of "Good and Evil" ((Radiant and Dire)) begin to blur exponentially...Those who find themselves corrupted by the Dire certainly wish to follow the life of chaos but...who is to say they were not innocent before then? Furthermore, which "side" is the 'keeper' on? He's the one who claims: "It always finds his way back to him..." Interesting for a war that has repeated a countless number of times ((Civilizations rising and falling...perhaps the Keeper has found immortality through simply corrupting others through the sword? He CLEARLY sent these two "nobodies" to fetch the sword for him...and promised them riches...he HAS TO KNOW WTF THE SWORD DOES, yes?))

                    -- "Heroes" are different...honestly I think the most interesting and simple way to answer: "how come -insert hero name here- isn't a creep?" What do I say? I say each and every hero has a personal "quest" ((Ingame mission)) that reveals how they themselves came into contact with the elusive "Demon Edge" and either through brute force, stupidity/ignorance, or whatever moral compass guides them...they do not turn into a creep? You could make this interesting and definitely establish "relationships" between heroes! Sure...Anti-Mage pretty much hates mages but...hell maybe a mage saved him from being corrupt? I dunno! ((Resisting corruption...or maybe just resisting so you can wreak more havok on the world for yourself))

                    -- Picking a side in the "Radiant vs Dire" I think this should be scrapped all together...I think the nature of "Radiant and Dire" is OBVIOUSLY important to lore...but in actual play it never matters? The only thing that "matters" is you can't have duplicates...which makes sense! ((Meta wise you literally can't have two players playing the same hero...and the concept of "which side you are on" pretty much boils down to arguments about which side has the better map layout between players))

                    -- What is a "game" are two sides battling to destroy the others "ancient" hence...defense of the ancients...I think the best way to approach this now is to simply acknowledge it as ((I hate opening pandoras boxes like these!)) these "Heroes" being chosen to...RELIVE one of the MANY BATTLES THE TWO ANCIENTS HAD WITHIN THE MOON ITSELF...How does this happen? Shit...fucking Faceless Void or Enigma...there are so many heroes capable of just "breaking logic" that maybe one(or more) of them just screwed up one day and are like: "...Well...I guess we pretty much damned the entirety of the planet to reliving the battle between Radiant and Dire over and over! Time to farm creeps!" I think this would work well with the aforementioned idea that...the heroes are more or less guided by their own personal goals ((Which is why they fight for Radiant OR Dire...not to mention they are both corrupt, right?)) I think the major roadblock that is currently in the game though is...the current lines of VA seem to...favor last hitting and denying ((Which they should since they are MAJOR mechanics of the game)) this would be a wrench to my aforementioned ideas...I'm sure there are countless more though!


                    • "and with the command -em, the war became a lot easier to fight"

                      OT: Great stuff, I love where this is going. Very exciting.


                      • no need for more lore. Just release the novels please.


                        • I'm sure someone has already pointed this out, but there's a typo: shouldn't "...allowed the Mad Moon's inhabitants to begin exploit" instead be "allowed the Mad Moon's inhabitants to begin to exploit" ? This typo also exists in the Archronicus text.


                          • Hey Lamprey,

                            I'm writing a magazine for Dota 2 and I wanted to include the lore you have written into my magazine. I don't want to plagiarize or sum it in my own words because of how well you have written the story. I was wondering if you would give me permission to replicate it.


                            • Pretty sure that Lamprey being a Valve employee and Valve being the developers, you are free to use what's written here. Especially considering that Lamprey hasn't been around in ages.
                              Heroes this user should seriously reconsider ever picking again.

                              THE DOTA 2 LORE MEGATHREAD IS TO BE UPDATED BY JULY 5TH

                              Visit the Dota 2 Lore Megathread. Renovation ongoing.


                              • Thank you for answering, I'll be sure to give credit to him in the article.

                                P.S. Great job on the mega lore post, it's really great.