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Add a forfeit function

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  • #31
    adding it it creates the idea it okay to forfeit.... just like adding dislike buttons on facebook it would be a good idea to dislike things... it either you like it or shut up. Now it's either continue to play and shut up. I rather see something against dragging a game when the winning party has a stronger lategame than a forfeit function to be honest.

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    • #32
      if the average dota game was 20 minutes, i don't think this would be an issue. a FF system is basically required if you plan on keeping any casual people playing on a long-term basis. as much fail as s2 has been the last year, this is one feature they've had that has had very little issue. This along with their community driven RAP system, which punishes ppl for abusing game mechanics like this or just trolling in general, makes the game much more enjoyable to play. If s2 can do it, then valve & icefrog should figure out a system that works for them. as much as hardcore dota people despise games like LoL or HoN, you need to put your biases aside and look at certain features each game may have implemented that have actually worked. I mean, why speculate on what COULD happen, when S2 already implemented this and it worked.

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      • #33
        I dont believe that their should be a ff feature. The game should end when and only when one of the Ancients falls. Even if 4 other players have given up, one might still want to give it a fighting chance.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Quicksilva View Post
          I dont believe that their should be a ff feature. The game should end when and only when one of the Ancients falls. Even if 4 other players have given up, one might still want to give it a fighting chance.
          People will forfeit no matter if we have a forfeit function or not. If we dont have a forfeit function, they will just stand in base and wait for the enemy to kill the ancient, which is essentially a bad way to handle it and a waste of time for all. True you might still want to play even though your team want to forfeit, but if your 4 teammates have already given up, it makes no sense. They might stand in fountain waiting for the game to end or go suicide just for the heck of it, so you have to defend alone. They might leave the game. Some times the game is just lost and i personally hate to waste those last 5-10 mins just waiting for the enemy to kill my ancient.
          When you join a game of Dota, you commit to it for its duration and play to win. Still, if the game is completely one-sided and you can see that you have obviously lost, there is no reason to spend the extra time just to watch your ancient die.
          Steam: bQttger

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          • #35
            people have a hard time letting go of old mechanics that were only in place b/c of the limitations of the wc3 engine.

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            • #36
              I think its a good idea to implement a Forfeit function. People will just leave the game anyways, if they think they have lost. People will leave if they can't forfeit, just like people are doing right now in the beta.
              Aka NamDohtem on PlayDotA.com
              Danish DOTA2 Steam Community http://steamcommunity.com/groups/DOTA2DK

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              • #37
                Originally posted by bQttger View Post
                People will forfeit no matter if we have a forfeit function or not. If we dont have a forfeit function, they will just stand in base and wait for the enemy to kill the ancient, which is essentially a bad way to handle it and a waste of time for all. True you might still want to play even though your team want to forfeit, but if your 4 teammates have already given up, it makes no sense. They might stand in fountain waiting for the game to end or go suicide just for the heck of it, so you have to defend alone. They might leave the game. Some times the game is just lost and i personally hate to waste those last 5-10 mins just waiting for the enemy to kill my ancient.
                When you join a game of Dota, you commit to it for its duration and play to win. Still, if the game is completely one-sided and you can see that you have obviously lost, there is no reason to spend the extra time just to watch your ancient die.
                The way I look at it is if you ever play in any other type of ladder/Match making system for any other game the do not have any kinds of rules in them a Forfeit would have to be a very specific and direct ruling that would only apply if something else has happened first while I would like to see this kind of thing implemented into the Match making system it seems very hard to make it balanced enough for everyone to like it, an example would be communities such as TDA or any other really.

                Most of the -league- based communities allow for forfeiting at any time in the game this works for leagues because most players are at a high skill level and are not doing it just to piss off the other team or just to get out becuase its not fun any more they are doing it because they know they have lost, now you implement this on a more public level such as TDA or even DotAPub in TDA no one liked the FF rules (well some did) because it took too long to get out of the game if the team felt they were going to lose (though this wasn't the case most of the time) this resulted in lots of people either ignoring the ruling and leaving then later claiming it was a rule misinterpretation or simply didnt care and left their account banned in DotApub it was even worse you would have teams forfeit in the first 10 minutes some times right after first blood.

                What I am saying is making a forfeit system will most likely back fire regardless of how much tweeking valve does to it, at higher levels it might be fine one game then completely suck or waste everyones time the next and at lower levels it will either be abused or everyone will just complain about it.

                For those who never played in TDA these are the FF rules.

                You may FF in the first 15 minutes if someone drops, if the time is beyond this you must wait till 30 minutes, if no player has dropped you must wait till 50 minutes (note this was before the meta game got faster and resulted most games to end around 30 - 40 minutes)
                Last edited by DBX_5; 09-19-2011, 02:40 PM.
                CPU make and model: intel i7 4700MQ 2.4ghz
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                • #38
                  If 5 players want to FF, why should we force them to play? They wont be "Omg, why did we ff we could have won that" if they ffed themselves. They wont go back to the game and watch it over and think about what they could have done diffrent. They will join a new game with new players and try to win the game again.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by DBX_5 View Post
                    The way I look at it is if you ever play in any other type of ladder/Match making system for any other game the do not have any kinds of rules in them a Forfeit would have to be a very specific and direct ruling that would only apply if something else has happened first while I would like to see this kind of thing implemented into the Match making system it seems very hard to make it balanced enough for everyone to like it, an example would be communities such as TDA or any other really.

                    Most of the -league- based communities allow for forfeiting at any time in the game this works for leagues because most players are at a high skill level and are not doing it just to piss off the other team or just to get out becuase its not fun any more they are doing it because they know they have lost, now you implement this on a more public level such as TDA or even DotAPub in TDA no one liked the FF rules (well some did) because it took too long to get out of the game if the team felt they were going to lose (though this wasn't the case most of the time) this resulted in lots of people either ignoring the ruling and leaving then later claiming it was a rule misinterpretation or simply didnt care and left their account banned in DotApub it was even worse you would have teams forfeit in the first 10 minutes some times right after first blood.

                    What I am saying is making a forfeit system will most likely back fire regardless of how much tweeking valve does to it, at higher levels it might be fine one game then completely suck or waste everyones time the next and at lower levels it will either be abused or everyone will just complain about it.

                    For those who never played in TDA these are the FF rules.

                    You may FF in the first 15 minutes if someone drops, if the time is beyond this you must wait till 30 minutes, if no player has dropped you must wait till 50 minutes (note this was before the meta game got faster and resulted most games to end around 30 - 40 minutes)
                    So why has it worked for HoN at both the competitive and low level?

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                    • #40
                      What is hons system btw, like I said I would like to see it as well it just seems like something that will be incredibly hard to balance accordingly though if hon has made something that works it would be worth while looking into then again HoN != DotA D=
                      CPU make and model: intel i7 4700MQ 2.4ghz
                      GPU make and model: Nvidia Geforce 860M
                      Ram: 8GB DDR3
                      Operating System: Win7 HP
                      Connection speed: 600KB/s || 100KB/s || 764MS

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by DBX_5 View Post
                        What is hons system btw, like I said I would like to see it as well it just seems like something that will be incredibly hard to balance accordingly though if hon has made something that works it would be worth while looking into then again HoN != DotA D=
                        HoN definitely does not equal dota, but its the closest comparison you could possibly make. You aren't allowed to concede until 15 minutes, but you need all 5 votes. Once it hits 30 minutes, you can concede with 4/5 votes. Leavers are also are taken into account, but I forget the exact numbers. This in combination with the RAP system they use, which is a community driven program that punishes people for anything you can think of, such as trolling, racism, and of course abusing the game system in any way. Leavers aren't punished b/c once you are a leaver in about 7 or 8% of the games, you are unable to play in non-leaver games.

                        I'm definitely not a big proponent of what S2 has done in general, but there are a few things they definitely did right, and this is one of them.

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                        • #42
                          Do you guys REALLY think there shouldn't be a forfeit function? It's really tiring having to play a game when you know you will lose, especially after someone leaves. 4v5's are very hard to win and 3v5's are almost impossible, especially when you're underfarmed.
                          Forfeit, player kick and leaver penalty are a MUST in retail, this isn't the best community on earth.

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                          • #43
                            As a lot of people have said already, forfeit has good aswell as bad aspects to it.

                            In HoN, a lot of players constantly call Concede votes after 15 Minutes, often times resulting in a ~20 minute concede, while the game wasn't even close to being over.

                            Overall, the biggest problem is that votes like that encourage giving up way too early, often taking any chance of turning the game around.

                            I'd say that a system that allows concedes as soon as the disadvantage is too huge would be the best solution. For example, you can forfeit when you are down 1 or 2 rax while the enemies still have theirs or when a team has 15000+ more gold than the other one. There are a lot of these indicators when games could be considered 'over' by the system and allow forfeits.
                            Last edited by BLABLAFU; 09-29-2011, 07:31 AM.

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                            • #44
                              I can't believe people are actually against a forfeit function, I am literally speechless, what madness. People are not going to hang around if they don't want to play, they will just leave. not having a ff function in 2011 is ludicrous. This is the sequel to dota folks not an update.

                              The people talking about 'ff spamming' are just scaremongering, ff spamming is prevented easily by imposing a time limit between the ability to call for a ff vote - wow, problem solved.

                              A ff function and leaver protection are stock standard industry staples that are mandatory in a AAA pvp game, people seriously need to move away from WC3.
                              Last edited by Newklearish; 09-29-2011, 07:42 AM.

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                              • #45
                                Yea we rly need a forfeit function i mean, where is the point in sitting in your well, because you know its over, and have to wait until the enemy is killing your throne.... that doesnt make sense, and a forfeit function would help here very much!

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