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Enemy Mana Bars

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  • Originally posted by Kaesetorte View Post
    Quite obviously the only argument to NOT implement this is that it wasn't in Dota1 and thats only because WC3 didnt allow it. lets face it... if wc3 allowed manabars noone here would ahve a problem with them being in this new game.
    again, not true.
    save up some time and read through the 75 pages.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by DiGodKolya View Post
      again, not true.
      save up some time and read through the 75 pages.
      i love how you do the exact same thing you are telling the person in your quote shouldn't do.

      mana bars were not possible in wc3 without heavy hacking of the engine, get real, they are possible, just like it is possible to see people through walls in counter strike.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by DiGodKolya View Post
        again, not true.
        save up some time and read through the 75 pages.
        this is a really dense argument, people who support no mana bars hate change so they want all of the old bugs and nonfeatures from the old game and keep dota 2 only as a graphics upgrade

        Comment


        • people who support mana bars hate change so they want all of the old features from their old game and want dota 2 to be their hon 2 or lol 2

          Comment


          • Originally posted by vladhood View Post
            people who support mana bars hate change so they want all of the old features from their old game and want dota 2 to be their hon 2 or lol 2
            yeah, another reason why I personally do not wish to have manabars is to make the dota game different to the other similiar games.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by crow View Post
              i love how you do the exact same thing you are telling the person in your quote shouldn't do.

              mana bars were not possible in wc3 without heavy hacking of the engine, get real, they are possible, just like it is possible to see people through walls in counter strike.
              Sorry?
              How is it the only argument to not have manabars?
              You should read what the guy said, it's not the only reason NOT to have manabars.
              The only reason you guys have though [pro manabars] is to make the game "easier". Aynthing else? Maybe because it's beautier to have a blue bar coupled with a green one?
              Right, there's only 1 reason to add it, while there's at least 3 i can think of that are against it
              If you are still too stubborn to notice that, you might as well continue with this until eternity.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by DiGodKolya View Post
                Sorry?
                How is it the only argument to not have manabars?
                You should read what the guy said, it's not the only reason NOT to have manabars.
                The only reason you guys have though [pro manabars] is to make the game "easier". Aynthing else? Maybe because it's beautier to have a blue bar coupled with a green one?
                Right, there's only 1 reason to add it, while there's at least 3 i can think of that are against it
                If you are still too stubborn to notice that, you might as well continue with this until eternity.
                you realize that your 5 contra arguments are really weak and have less bearing than just 1 pro argument? you're in ignoramus bliss, i am still going to be better than you WITH or WITHOUT mana bars.

                regards,
                crow.

                Comment


                • Even though I am mostly agaisnt publically visible stats I sometimes would lvoe to be capable to see those of certain players. I bet crows stats linked with his arrogant statement would give me a good laugh

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                  • Hi guys,

                    again i want to said something to this topic. Did you guys took a look in the PD forums, i create a Poll to this topic with assistence of Dota2Panda. The result of the poll was with us, we won that battle that manabars are fine and not destroying the game. We discussed this a lot... but fanboys of old DotA, they refused to listen -.- doesn't care how much you are trying to explain it to them... they ignore the arguements and only see what they want to see....

                    But i am trying to explain it again.

                    Pros for manabars:
                    - the feature of manabars is already in the game, you need just to click it on, there is no reason to hide it. When you dont want manabars then remove it completely
                    -like others said DotA couldn't use Manabars, because of his outdated engine, but Dota 2 has his own engine.

                    contra:
                    - remove "Mindgames": It's just an excuse for you guys, because you don't like an faster paced and difficult game. Because if the enemy can see your mana, you need to be smart to use the fog right to kill him still. tl'dr: through hidden manabars it's just hard for newbies. you can easier stomp them.
                    - Anti-Mage as reason is invalid. Why? Simple, because there are heroes like Axe, Zeus or Necro and Blood Seeker, who can use the detailed health bars like Anti-Mage can use the advantage of manabars.

                    My vote goes for manabars!

                    greets,

                    sorry for my bad english
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • Still no single elegant argument against mana bars.
                      Nothing but crap from trash players want to keep "features" of crappy wc3 engine.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by horoz View Post
                        Still no single elegant argument against mana bars.
                        Nothing but crap from trash players want to keep "features" of crappy wc3 engine.
                        Have you read my thoughts?

                        Comment


                        • No arguments for manabars in this thread. I'd like to go for pro-manabars, but it seems to be impossible at the moment because I see no chance to get them implemented soon. So the discussion about it is pretty much worthless and most of the people here aren't arguing seriously anyway.
                          Just saying: Pretending that a feature where ~50% of all players are against has no downsides is actually pretty ignorant. You really should think about why you're writing into this thread in the first place.
                          Also, slowly I understand why all these elitists are raging about HoN and LoL-players = =

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by crow View Post
                            i am still going to be better than you [B]WITH or WITHOUT mana bars.
                            This is irrelevant to the argument. Fact is that there WILL be people who are worse than others specifically due to the availability or lack of availability of mana bars.

                            Someone who doesn't bother check-clicking enemies may be better than someone who does if mana bars are on display, but vice versa if they aren't.

                            People who are better regardless and people who are worse regardless shouldn't be the focus of this discussion because it makes no difference in their regard except the 'improvements are good stop clinging to limited engines' line. Being better with or without is not a pro line it's an indifferent line.

                            Adding mana-bars unnecessarily alters the skill-success distribution of a portion of the playerbase.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Typhox View Post
                              No arguments for manabars in this thread. I'd like to go for pro-manabars, but it seems to be impossible at the moment because I see no chance to get them implemented soon. So the discussion about it is pretty much worthless and most of the people here aren't arguing seriously anyway.
                              Just saying: Pretending that a feature where ~50% of all players are against has no downsides is actually pretty ignorant. You really should think about why you're writing into this thread in the first place.
                              Also, slowly I understand why all these elitists are raging about HoN and LoL-players = =
                              Last line is exactly my thought. Except that I would cut out elitists and probably insert a "certain" in forn of HoN and Lol-palyers. (Oh well I actually agree with most of the post.)

                              @horoz: Those trash players and WC 3's crappy engine are part of what made this game so succesfull.

                              Also here`s your elegant argument:
                              It changes Gameplay! (and balance, but who gives ahit)

                              You say "NO" ?

                              Then I`ve got an example for you: You see a Slark using a certain amount of Mana without any real animation happening. What did he just do? Will you bother stunning / slowing /silencing / dusting / whaterver him within the next 1.5 seconds? If you answer "Yes", you are plainly bad and if you answer "NO" your first "NO" is wrong as it obviously changed the gameplay.

                              Obviously if you don`t even know what Hero Slark is, since you`ve probably didn`t play DotA 1 for one year and now want it to adept to the Gameplay you are used too instead of adepting yourself you can`t answer this question.

                              I mean this xample isn`t even hard to grasp. It is totally simple, nothing as complex (and seemingly never heard off) as those "mindgames" or "Animation Canceling" or "Situations that include more then one hero because clicking one hero is easy enough and just annoyance and not an real investment of time"

                              The worst thing about this topic is, as someone allready mentoned: The pro Mana Bar side will never shut up. And as everybody knows, sooner or later naggers always win.
                              Last edited by Cocofang; 12-03-2011, 06:45 AM.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Cocofang View Post
                                Last line is exactly my thought. Except that I would cut out elitists and probably insert a "certain" in forn of HoN and Lol-palyers. (Oh well I actually agree with most of the post.)

                                @horoz: Those trash players and WC 3's crappy engine are part of what made this game so succesfull.

                                Also here`s your elegant argument:
                                It changes Gameplay! (and balance, but who gives ahit)

                                You say "NO" ?

                                Then I`ve got an example for you: You see a Slark using a certain amount of Mana without any real animation happening. What did he just do? Will you bother stunning / slowing /silencing / dusting / whaterver him within the next 1.5 seconds? If you answer "Yes", you are plainly bad and if you answer "NO" your first "NO" is wrong as it obviously changed the gameplay.

                                Obviously if you don`t even know what Hero Slark is, since you`ve probably didn`t play DotA 1 for one year and now want it to adept to the Gameplay you are used too instead of adepting yourself you can`t answer this question.

                                I mean this xample isn`t even hard to grasp. It is totally simple, nothing as complex (and seemingly never heard off) as those "mindgames" or "Animation Canceling" or "Situations that include more then one hero because clicking one hero is easy enough and just annoyance and not an real investment of time"

                                The worst thing about this topic is, as someone allready mentoned: The pro Mana Bar side will never shut up. And as everybody knows, sooner or later naggers always win.
                                So what if it changes gameplay? All changes do that doesn't make them wrong or bad.

                                It's an improvement to the display of information that make the game less tedious. If this somehow makes some heroes weaker than others then other small changes should be made to make them stronger.

                                How can you not compare it to lifebars? Lifebars would be a fucking gigantic change to gameplay, for the better, if they didn't exist and were added.

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