Announcement

Collapse

Forum Rules

  • No flaming or derogatory remarks, directly or through insinuation.
  • No discussion, sharing or referencing illegal software such as hacks, keygen, cracks and pirated software.
  • No offensive contents, including but not limited to, racism, gore or pornography.
  • No excessive spam/meme, i.e. copious one liners in a short period of time, typing with all caps or posting meme responses (text/image).
  • No trolling, including but not limited to, flame incitation, user provocation or false information distribution.
  • No link spamming or signature advertisements for content not specific to Dota 2.
  • No Dota 2 key requests, sell, trade etc.
  • You may not create multiple accounts for any purpose, including ban evasion, unless expressly permitted by a moderator.

  • Please search before posting. One thread per issue. Do not create another thread if there is an existing one already.
  • Before posting anything, make sure you check out all sticky threads (e.g., this). Do not create new threads about closed ones.
  • It is extremely important that you post in correct forum section.

  • Balance discussion only in Misc.
  • All art related (such as hero model) feedbacks go to Art Feedback Forum.
  • All matchmaking feedback should go here: Matchmaking Feedback
  • All report/low priority issues should go here: Commend/Report/Ban Feedback
  • No specific workshop item feedback. These should go to workshop page of that item.
  • When posting in non-bugs section (such as this), use [Bugs], [Discussion] or [Suggestion] prefix in your thread name.



In case you object some action by a moderator, please contact him directly through PM and explain your concerns politely. If you are still unable to resolve the issue, contact an administrator. Do not drag these issues in public.



All rules are meant to augment common sense, please use them when not conflicted with aforementioned policies.
See more
See less

We really need stats now.

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by DarkSuo View Post
    OP racist and a jerk. Just close this.
    Russians have been a huge problem in HoN as well. Thier solution was to put all the Russian accounts on Garena and it helped really well.
    Although russians are not a part of this discussion, my opinion is:
    If they fail to communicate in the most common language with other people that aren't russians (which is English) they shouldn't be playing dota2 OR they should have their own servers.
    It happens so often that I don't understand a damn of anything and they cannot even write "ss, gank, push" and basic stuff like that.
    I recently learned that what seems like the letter "c" is actually "s". We had an ogre magi that kept saying "cc1" which stood for "ss1" (missing 1 hero) took a while to learn that. lol

    Anyway, Russians have nothing to do with this discussion.
    If anybody is asking why I am reffering to HoN all the time, it is because they have failed a lot and learned from their mistakes (more or less) and dota2 could do the same mistakes. Let's not let this happen.
    Never underestimate the power of the masses.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by ranaki View Post
      My main is AngryBalls
      My secondary main is Buttviolator (mostly screw around on this acc)
      Ranaki is my oldest acc

      All accounts are linked to each other (sub accounts)

      Although I must excuse that I said I screwed up my KD with one of my smurfs, the KD on my main is slightly under 1.5
      However again I can now refer to:
      "People lie but stats don't"



      Sounds intresting, I am up for it. Although human failiure is involved often I am not 100% accurate, but I could tell who is a average good player and who is not.
      I would like samples from people that only went solo MM. Teams often have far better stats than they often are, so it always happens that I overistmate people on my team or on the enemy team, which is also intresting. As I said, it's not always accurate.

      What I have noticed in HoN is that new players and people in the lower bracket the APM is always low. Someone who has 1800 MMR has almost 3times as much APM as someone in the 1500 bracket that just started playing like a month ago. But since dota2 has a bit slower unit reaction time than in HoN the APM should differ a lot here.

      I am neither familiar with the average Dota2 stats at all yet, it would help if I would be able to see peoples stats everygame in order to make a conclusion of "what is average" which I don't have.
      We can perform the test, but since HoN and Dota2 aren't exact copies of each other and I only know the average stats of HoN it won't be that very accurate here in dota2. Sounds like a fun test, but for now while stats are hidden I will most likely fail it since I don't know what is average.


      Anyway, the Idea about making an alternative matchmaking where stats are hidden sounds like another great solution for this.
      I believe, the more different things a player can choose from, the better the game becomes. As long as it doesn't seem too messy.

      So, as long as there is a good and easy design in the UI and things are not explained too complicated it won't harm anything to have different sort of matchmaking options.
      There should also be a "non-rating" matchmaking, that queues you up with random people and doesn't record any stat. you will then also recieve battlepoints playing that mode.

      It should be obvious for Valve now that the dota2 community consists of 2 major parts of people about this problem. So why not make 2 different game modes? It seems, after being part in this discussion after a long time impossible to create something that we both are ok with.
      I would also enjoy playing a different matchmaking where no stats are shown once in a while, as well as you would probably want to play with stats sometimes.



      Maybe they could fix it that the stats show for all / for none depending on what the average MMR of the entire game is.
      If you have let's say a game where the average MMR is 9, but stats will first show at 10, the stats are hidden.
      If it's a game where the average MMR is 11, even though one or two players have only 8 MMR, thier stats will show in that game.
      good thing that not one of ur accounts has even 60% win and that ur last 5 games are 1/6/4 3/2/5 9/13/8 4/10/17 and 1/17/7 and 4 / 5 lost

      ye i wonder too why u have only 80-100% win and why ur so strong

      mb u should give lessons to others? oO
      /

      Comment


      • Originally posted by wolleesel View Post
        good thing that not one of ur accounts has even 60% win and that ur last 5 games are 1/6/4 3/2/5 9/13/8 4/10/17 and 1/17/7 and 4 / 5 lost

        ye i wonder too why u have only 80-100% win and why ur so strong

        mb u should give lessons to others? oO
        /
        This is possibly the strongest argument against stats there could ever be. Here, in this thread, while debating whether we should have stats, people are flaming each other and shouting "noob! noob!" based on nothing more than recent KDR.
        Please help keep the forums clean by reporting rude or abusive posts!
        Got a problem? PM me or another moderator!
        Forum Rules

        Comment


        • Very bad idea, it will be ruin the game.

          If valve puts stats in game people will play for stats not for fun.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by DarkLite View Post
            This is possibly the strongest argument against stats there could ever be. Here, in this thread, while debating whether we should have stats, people are flaming each other and shouting "noob! noob!" based on nothing more than recent KDR.
            that is because people who are bad usually don't want stats, because they get flamed for it.
            I do not flame others stats, stats are only for information that everyone should hold for themselves.

            People who are better and have more insight in the game have usually opinions that matter more for the higher tier of the game, where stats are important.
            You can clearly tell who is a moron by just looking at people who yell "omfg noob with thoas statts" without any reason. They should be banned or like I do, simply ignore them.

            Originally posted by wolleesel View Post
            good thing that not one of ur accounts has even 60% win and that ur last 5 games are 1/6/4 3/2/5 9/13/8 4/10/17 and 1/17/7 and 4 / 5 lost

            ye i wonder too why u have only 80-100% win and why ur so strong

            mb u should give lessons to others? oO
            /
            Since I don't really like replying to trolls I will keep it short:
            If you have reached a harder bracket it becomes harder to keep your "good stats" since the ones you meet become better. On my main I rarely play solo MM anymore, because simply said: it is too hard to win alone. That is why I have a few other accounts.
            I said it in a previous post as well, if you keep playing in a higher bracket where your skill has it's limit and others are better of course your stats become "worse" since you aren't the best in that bracket anylonger.

            Stats should be divided in what bracket you currently play in.
            That means if you would have HoN's measurement:

            When you start the game in the 1500 bracket you have no stats of course
            Once you reach 1650 you have like a new tab for stats. if you play with people from the 1500 bracket again, only your 1500 stats will be affected.
            Next level would be at around 1700, and then 1750, then 1800 and so on.

            That way, you would see how good you are in your current highest bracket.

            I believe on my main I would only have about 0.9 KD and maybe slightly over 50% win, while I would have like 80% win and a KD of like 4 or 5 in the 1500 bracket, because it is too easy for me.
            Last edited by ranaki; 07-06-2012, 07:31 AM.
            Never underestimate the power of the masses.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by DarkLite View Post
              This is possibly the strongest argument against stats there could ever be. Here, in this thread, while debating whether we should have stats, people are flaming each other and shouting "noob! noob!" based on nothing more than recent KDR.
              making stuff up and taking it out of context roxx

              so many politicians here

              Comment


              • We do need stats. The strange items idea is cool, but I hate having to unlock an item to see how many wards I placed -_-

                Comment


                • NO PLEASE GOD NO.

                  Stats say NOTHING about how good a player is, if I constantly play Crystal Maiden and have an avg k/d/a of 3/10/20 doesnt mean i'm bad.

                  Comment


                  • This thread is so huge I think posting here is like signing a petition either for or against stats.

                    Let me voice my opinion for not having stats. As someone who usually plays an initiator or support, stats would only serve to diminish this role. It's bad enough at the end of a game when the carry gets all the "good job AM", and I often go unnoticed for spending the game softening up creeps so he can last hit, warding, initiating, etc...

                    If stats got in and my friends started judging each other on k/d, I sure as heck would start supporting and initiating less. Plus some of my friends are already pretty bad about killstealing, this would just take it to a level beyond being a minor nuisance.

                    Keep the game about teamplay and winning, not stats. I think a big part of why the community seems to be sloooooowly improving is because people aren't as worried about epeen shrinkage if they should lose a game, and omg, my MMR rating will be effected and omg my friends can't admire my massive epeen..... Please keep stats out.

                    Comment


                    • So upon finding this thread I thought to myself "I should read through this thread and see general opinion" then I see the 126 page of people who hate stats and people who don't

                      FROM MY EXPERIENCE STATS ARE TERRIBLE

                      I started from HoN playing with elitist jerks who only cared about stats, this was heavily reflected in the community aswell. I was denied several attempts at mid just because my k;d;r was below 1. Stats like this bring out the worst in the community and give power to the elitist types who demand a way to keep their ego polished. Stats are shit. Don't implement

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by hopfrogg View Post
                        This thread is so huge I think posting here is like signing a petition either for or against stats.

                        Let me voice my opinion for not having stats. As someone who usually plays an initiator or support, stats would only serve to diminish this role. It's bad enough at the end of a game when the carry gets all the "good job AM", and I often go unnoticed for spending the game softening up creeps so he can last hit, warding, initiating, etc...

                        If stats got in and my friends started judging each other on k/d, I sure as heck would start supporting and initiating less. Plus some of my friends are already pretty bad about killstealing, this would just take it to a level beyond being a minor nuisance.

                        Keep the game about teamplay and winning, not stats. I think a big part of why the community seems to be sloooooowly improving is because people aren't as worried about epeen shrinkage if they should lose a game, and omg, my MMR rating will be effected and omg my friends can't admire my massive epeen..... Please keep stats out.
                        That is why most played heroes (which already is displayed) should be expanded. Because it shows if you are a good support player or not if you only should've played support and would be the reason for your "lower stats". and your teammates should have the right to know how good you actually are.
                        Like I said, KD isn't important as long as you don't go mid, even if you play defensive in mid it doesn't matter a lot.
                        The most important is the Win%, if you are a really good support player, you should have a higher win% than a bad support player.

                        Originally posted by Kawaii View Post
                        So upon finding this thread I thought to myself "I should read through this thread and see general opinion" then I see the 126 page of people who hate stats and people who don't

                        FROM MY EXPERIENCE STATS ARE TERRIBLE

                        I started from HoN playing with elitist jerks who only cared about stats, this was heavily reflected in the community aswell. I was denied several attempts at mid just because my k;d;r was below 1. Stats like this bring out the worst in the community and give power to the elitist types who demand a way to keep their ego polished. Stats are shit. Don't implement
                        Like I said:
                        Your teammates have the right to know how good you are.
                        Flaming stats should be strictly forbidden and those who do it should be treated with no mercy.

                        in the lower brackets I can agree that stats don't matter.
                        But when you come to a point where you have to work hard to win and want to become better you need stats. Especially if you, like me, choose to try out other peoples way of playing and a lot of that has to do with seeing other peoples stats.
                        Last edited by ranaki; 07-06-2012, 08:32 AM.
                        Never underestimate the power of the masses.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by ranaki View Post
                          that is because people who are bad usually don't want stats, because they get flamed for it.
                          I do not flame others stats, stats are only for information that everyone should hold for themselves.

                          People who are better and have more insight in the game have usually opinions that matter more for the higher tier of the game, where stats are important.
                          You can clearly tell who is a moron by just looking at people who yell "omfg noob with thoas statts" without any reason. They should be banned or like I do, simply ignore them.



                          Since I don't really like replying to trolls I will keep it short:
                          If you have reached a harder bracket it becomes harder to keep your "good stats" since the ones you meet become better. On my main I rarely play solo MM anymore, because simply said: it is too hard to win alone. That is why I have a few other accounts.
                          I said it in a previous post as well, if you keep playing in a higher bracket where your skill has it's limit and others are better of course your stats become "worse" since you aren't the best in that bracket anylonger.

                          Stats should be divided in what bracket you currently play in.
                          That means if you would have HoN's measurement:

                          When you start the game in the 1500 bracket you have no stats of course
                          Once you reach 1650 you have like a new tab for stats. if you play with people from the 1500 bracket again, only your 1500 stats will be affected.
                          Next level would be at around 1700, and then 1750, then 1800 and so on.

                          That way, you would see how good you are in your current highest bracket.

                          I believe on my main I would only have about 0.9 KD and maybe slightly over 50% win, while I would have like 80% win and a KD of like 4 or 5 in the 1500 bracket, because it is too easy for me.

                          The amount of dudes here calling everyone troll is quite amusing

                          Yes what u just wrote completly contradicted ur statement 2 pages ago, but who cares - im a troll


                          U make me sick oO the only question i have is wether or not u realize just how big of a hypocrate u are (wtf this sounds strange but u get the message i hope)

                          Comment


                          • Horrible idea if made public.

                            Go for a nice pub game, and instantly raged at before game even starts. Even if you are a pro there will always be people who complain about you and say they are better and therefore you deserve their hate.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by wolleesel View Post
                              The amount of dudes here calling everyone troll is quite amusing

                              Yes what u just wrote completly contradicted ur statement 2 pages ago, but who cares - im a troll


                              U make me sick oO the only question i have is wether or not u realize just how big of a hypocrate u are (wtf this sounds strange but u get the message i hope)
                              People like you shouldn't be in the dev forums.
                              I am trying to get to an agreement or solution that suits most people, including myself.

                              There are obviously people that want stats as much as people who don't want them. Either decision would ruin the game for a part of the community.

                              The reason why my statements are different from 2 pages ago is because I am trying to get to an understanding, which works with compromising with each other. Something you obviously fail to do and therefore you shouldn't be in the dev forums.
                              Either you discuss this without making groundless statements or trying to spin off the discussion, or you go away.

                              In conclusion of what I wrote so you you may understand it due it seems like you have a bit poor understanding:
                              I am not a hypocrite, I am trying to come to an compromise or solution between the two "sides" of this thread.
                              My own beliefs are still that stats should be public for everyone. Unlike you, I am trying to bring this discussion forward.

                              Originally posted by Furan917 View Post
                              Horrible idea if made public.

                              Go for a nice pub game, and instantly raged at before game even starts. Even if you are a pro there will always be people who complain about you and say they are better and therefore you deserve their hate.
                              What if there were two different matchmakings then?
                              One with stats, one without.

                              The one without would work the same way as the current mm system.
                              The one with stats would be the same, just that all information about every player should be displayed for each other.

                              The community is huge enough, so it won't affect the queue time too much.
                              This would mean that people like me would be playing with all other tryhards, while the mm with hidden stats will be more like "play for fun", which is what almost all that are against stats want as far as I understand it.

                              In addition to this, there should be other game modes, like midwars and easy mode. Maybe even a way to play custom game maps
                              Last edited by ranaki; 07-06-2012, 08:58 AM.
                              Never underestimate the power of the masses.

                              Comment


                              • For all the people who are soooo butt-hurt that they can't see stats:

                                http://stats.dota2.be

                                Stats are already readily available for people to see.

                                Good day and good luck on the battlefield.
                                Last edited by dandandan; 07-06-2012, 08:55 AM.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X