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Invoker: The Only Hero Who Doesn't Know His Own Cooldowns

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  • #31
    It's not a problem, because new players won't use that many abilities anyway. and by the time the new players learn how to use invokers every spell they should be able to know the cds without even looking.
    maybe something like this would be interesting:
    above the invoke spell there will be a small green light showing that spells are available, it'll turn red as soon as you cast it and it'll be shown for each invoker ability, it'll help newer players to realize that there's still spells to cast.

    Comment


    • #32
      Invoker has many, many faults in regards to information display. I'm thinking more of the 'disable/slow duration based on quas/wex' and 'damage due to quas/wex/exort' part which isn't displayed directly when you invoke the skill, so you never know exactly how much damage/disable/slow you do, contrarary to all other skills in the game. I voted for displaying the cooldowns, but now I'm thinking that either the creation of invoker was too short-sighted and didn't think about this kind of complicated interface, or that rather (possibly more likely) playing invoker is all about estimating how much damage each of your skills according to the level of orbs as well as keeping track of (approximate) cooldowns on when each skill will be ready, and that's part of playing him

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      • #33
        not needed

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by vladhood View Post
          cant believe someone said 'artificial difficulty' in this thread

          please see your way out
          You did nothing but basically imply that "ITS NOOB THING PLS GO TO LOL"

          I have invoker on my most succesful heroes and over 1200 games, i have no problem with his cooldowns but i hate when i invoke something with a big cd like chaos meteor on the middle of the fight, just to see that it still got 5~10 secs of cooldown leaving me without spells for 5 seconds, because i had no way to check his cooldowns while you can do it with every single other hero.

          I does not make the game easy in any way, it just avoids unnecessary trouble.

          It's just like saying "we don't need HP bars or any kind of stat saying how much damage or strenght/agility/intelligence you have because if you are good you are able to know the exact damage you have and the amount of stats by adding up every value by every item, but the items have no names or icons because if you are good you know which item it is by checking its stats."

          If you can't give any proper reason on why it is a bad thing, it's 100% artificial difficulty.
          Last edited by Swordz; 09-17-2012, 12:40 PM.
          http://www.youtube.com/user/swordzzzzz

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Ezalor
            While you're at it also remove te need for invoking spells and just give them free macros allowing to cast spells when invoke is off cooldown

            And install LoL on everybody's computer
            You, sir, are a moron. Please don't post on the dev forums again until you have elevated your IQ beyond that of a glass of water. Invoker is the ONLY hero who can't see the cooldown of ALL his abilities. And consistency should be...well...CONSISTENT. Why shouldn't Invoker, like every other hero, be able to see the cooldown of all his skills? It makes no sense why he can't. I fully support this because, not only does it bring Invoker into line with EVERY OTHER HERO, but it also makes him that little bit simpler to play without taking away the skill required to play him. And that can only be a good thing. Anyone who thinks different probably shouldn't be running their mouths on this forum.

            Comment


            • #36
              Put all 10 spells on the opposite side of the "hero buffs" and put a cd number on it. Nice, clean and easy to read.

              Also,
              The][nquisitoR you are brutally truthful about this guy mental capabilities.
              If you don't have an intelligent reply for me, don't bother I will shred your non sense to pieces.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by The][nquisitoR View Post
                Anyone who thinks different probably shouldn't be running their mouths on this forum.
                It was going so well until this last sentence.

                Comment


                • #38
                  nooooooo invoker already too good with his skill :x
                  Remove Signature NOW
                  Watching useless red text about mute system hurt my eyes and my brain

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by The][nquisitoR View Post
                    And consistency should be...well...CONSISTENT. Why shouldn't Invoker, like every other hero, be able to see the cooldown of all his skills? It makes no sense why he can't. I fully support this because, not only does it bring Invoker into line with EVERY OTHER HERO, but it also makes him that little bit simpler to play without taking away the skill required to play him. And that can only be a good thing.


                    Ha? Wha...?
                    http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post363428
                    http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post391229
                    http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post387107
                    http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post387566
                    http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post413548
                    http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post433719

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      While we're at it, please add a range / AoE indicator for shadowraze. It's too hard to know, how far 200, 450 and 700 range is, not to mention how big a 250 AoE is, without seeing it. Oh and if Geo comes out next update, please make something, so we can see all the cooldowns of each individual geomancer as well. Also please add a stun duration counter for every stun, like CK has [I know CK has this for a reason, dont even bother trying]. Or a countdown for holy persuation, also visible for enemies, so that they know if its worth it nuking him down or not, because I can't count down to three [or 6-1 per level] in my head. Oh and before I forget it I'd always like to know which skillevel of what particular spell hit me, because I can't look at enemy levels to figure out myself. Last thing would be cool if Rubick gets to know how long the enemy spell he stole is, is still on CD.

                      Guys this game has one of the steepest learning curves ever. This is what makes the game so good and keeps people motivated to keep improving. I know I'll get flamed for this, but if you want a dumbed down version I suggest you to try an other game. Because it starts out with simple things like these and ends with stuff I wrote above.

                      Knowing your spells, is what makes carl, carl - be it cooldown / effect duration / damage / range of each level - not even precisely but approximately is definetely enough to play a good invoker. Even the pros had to train hard to get this good. It didn't come out of nowhere, like: I randomed carl, but I've never played this hero! Oh, okay I got this, I'm pro.
                      Hell, back then you even had to type -invokelist in chat to even know which combination do what and that shit didn't even display permanently, so you had to type it multiple times, until the abrevation of -il was finally added, which made things a bit easier. Now we have a tiny window telling us everything we want to know, so we don't have to memorize as much. Yes I'm probably a bit of an elitist and nostalgia fag, but keep in mind: Tons of other players, went through this learning process perfectly fine and a majority of them even under worse "training conditions" [namely calssic DotA], now being fine players, without all that extra shenanigans certain people want to implement, to make things easier for them, because they are not motivation enough to learn things.

                      tl;dr: Learn this game. everyone else went through this before you. There are many simplified things already in Dota2.
                      Last edited by SilverDust; 09-18-2012, 11:02 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by SilverDust View Post
                        While we're at it, please add a range / AoE indicator for shadowraze. It's too hard to know, how far 200, 450 and 700 range is, not to mention how big a 250 AoE is, without seeing it. Oh and if Geo comes out next update, please make something, so we can see all the cooldowns of each individual geomancer as well. Also please add a stun duration counter for every stun, like CK has [I know CK has this for a reason, dont even bother trying]. Or a countdown for holy persuation, also visible for enemies, so that they know if its worth it nuking him down or not, because I can't count down to three [or 6-1 per level] in my head. Oh and before I forget it I'd always like to know which skillevel of what particular spell hit me, because I can't look at enemy levels to figure out myself. Last thing would be cool if Rubick gets to know how long the enemy spell he stole is, is still on CD.

                        Guys this game has one of the steepest learning curves ever. This is what makes the game so good and keeps people motivated to keep improving. I know I'll get flamed for this, but if you want a dumbed down version I suggest you to try an other game. Because it starts out with simple things like these and ends with stuff I wrote above.

                        Knowing your spells, is what makes carl, carl - be it cooldown / effect duration / damage / range of each level - not even precisely but approximately is definetely enough to play a good invoker. Even the pros had to train hard to get this good. It didn't come out of nowhere, like: I randomed carl, but I've never played this hero! Oh, okay I got this, I'm pro.
                        Hell, back then you even had to type -invokelist in chat to even know which combination do what and that shit didn't even display permanently, so you had to type it multiple times, until the abrevation of -il was finally added, which made things a bit easier. Now we have a tiny window telling us everything we want to know, so we don't have to memorize as much. Yes I'm probably a bit of an elitist and nostalgia fag, but keep in mind: Tons of other players, went through this learning process perfectly fine and a majority of them even under worse "training conditions" [namely calssic DotA], now being fine players, without all that extra shenanigans certain people want to implement, to make things easier for them, because they are not motivation enough to learn things.

                        tl;dr: Learn this game. everyone else went through this before you. There are many simplified things already in Dota2.
                        I actually said a few of the lines you said in there a couple of times. Many of which i wrote down then just erased...

                        Something i said before was newbs can't be spoonfed. I said it once i think but wrote it down many times (.. bleh.. i don't want to start a fight with anyone, but when crappy suggestions get in common suggestions list... something has to happen). Even primary school children use online sources to help their homework because teachers refuse to help them without them giving some effort...



                        Mods, i ask you to close useless threads like this.
                        Devs: the best thing i enjoyed in this game when i 1st started playing it was how everybody was raping me while i couldn't do shit even when i joined "APEM MEGA NOOB" games (there was no bot-maps when i started playing so i had to ruin others' games), then i picked up the game quite well... and started raping others.
                        http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post363428
                        http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post391229
                        http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post387107
                        http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post387566
                        http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post413548
                        http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post433719

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          It shouldn't be a baseline change, but there is absolutely no reason to not make it an option within the game. As long as I can turn it off so it's not cluttering up my UI, then I don't have a problem with it.

                          I don't get why people complain about it being 'too easy'. I think anything that helps newer players adjust to the learning curve should be fine, within reason. As long as there is an option to turn it off if, then I don't really see what everyones problem is. The way I see it, if new players are performing better with this option, then I'm going to have less people feeding on my team, which makes for a better experience for every single player involved.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Other heroes can see their cooldowns, why not Invoker?

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by God of Death View Post
                              Hahahahahahahaha. Then we should be removing recommended items, allied HP-bars, enemy HP-bars, hide enemy mana-bars etc because HEY! THE GOOD PLAYERS KNOW EXACTLY HOW MUCH HP THE ENEMY HAS BY DOING (STRx19 + 150 + HP FROM ITEMS)!

                              Brilliant fucking logic there.
                              Aren't you overreacting a bit? It's good to make some things easier when possible and more noob friendly, but there are limits. For example, implementing friendly manabars didn't change much because it's used just for Arcane boots and Chakra magic, while if they implemented enemy manabars it would further lower the noob-pro cap, because it takes some skill to check enemy manabars in the middle of a teamfight.
                              Putting Invoker's cooldowns at any other place other than their normal cooldown when they are invoked is, in my opinion, another unnecessary way of lowering that cap.

                              Oh and I'd like to add that many of you are saying "other heroes can see their cooldowns, why not Invoker?" Yes, he can. That is the whole point. When they are invoked, that is. You are the ones that want to make him even more different than others, and then you use an argument which states that he has to be more like others. It doesn't make sense. Valve helped more than enough by implementing hotkey support for him which wasn't available in DotA, and the ability to see his spells with a single click, without having to type -invokelist.
                              Last edited by posnisir; 09-23-2012, 06:17 AM.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Typhox View Post
                                Other heroes can see their cooldowns, why not Invoker?
                                I usually have great respect for your posts... but what is this?
                                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post363428
                                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post391229
                                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post387107
                                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post387566
                                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post413548
                                http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post433719

                                Comment

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