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Thread: Valve, please stop averaging Elo. It's not the way a team game should work.

  1. #1
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    Valve, please stop averaging Elo. It's not the way a team game should work.

    I have seen the posts fletcher has been making and in his posts, he talks about how the match making was selected because the Elo of a stack was averaged and matched with similar players. It's Dota. Even one guy feeding will ruin the entire match. Please stop averaging Elos. Take more time in MM but give us all players around our range and not teams of random players wit hequal averaged Elo.

  2. #2
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    [ ] Faster queue times
    [ ] Bracketing

    Pick one.

  3. #3
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    Consider a 4-stack with a big skill differential between the players. What we try to do is match them such that the teams are as equal as possible, player-by-player. (Sort the players on each team by Elo, and then examine the difference in Elo of corresponding opponents. Ideally the best playes on each team are evenly matched, the 2nd best are evenly matched, etc.) So that is pretty straightforward for figuring out the ideal thing to put on the other team, and notice that average Elo is not necessary. But what sort of a party should we use to fill the 5th slot as his ally? Would it be a good idea to find a single guy who matches the lowest skilled player on the 4-stack? The highest?How would that guy appraise the match we made for him, being the best player in the game playing with a bunch of players far worse than he is, or the worst player, with players much better than he is? What if we cannot find a 4 stack that matches him well? Would it be a good idea instead to take two 2-stacks, one that match the top two players, and one that matches the bottom two? What is going to be their reaction to being put in such a match?

    What would you say is the optimal way to match a stack with a large spread in skill?

  4. #4
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    Hey fletcher,

    something unrelated:

    Is it possible for Smurf to get into to high areas, because of smurf protection? It's mostly a theoreitcal question, since the last game I had with a smurf he was kinda bad, but I guess that might have been just unlucky.

    I also think that unrelated to MM, something else should be done about smurfs. They usually are among the most annoying players you can meet (cause there probably is a reason why they smurf) That specific smurf flamed me in the beginning for picking Meepo (while the game ended up going completely different from what he thought ) and near the end he started to berate our enemies because they were split-pushing (arguably one of the best split-pushes I've seen in a pub.) but inthe end it was a pretty damn nice and close game. We even got a try at their Throne, before we lost :P

    I guess it's a good thing that MM pushes Smurfs into higher areas, where people are less likely to quit though.

    P.S. (and even more unrelated) Do you guys take any suggestions for tutorial scenarios or different sturcturing of the Tutorial Map?

  5. #5
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    Instead of complaining about matchmaking, you can actually do something about it by improving.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by fletcher View Post
    Consider a 4-stack with a big skill differential between the players. What we try to do is match them such that the teams are as equal as possible, player-by-player. (Sort the players on each team by Elo, and then examine the difference in Elo of corresponding opponents. Ideally the best playes on each team are evenly matched, the 2nd best are evenly matched, etc.) So that is pretty straightforward for figuring out the ideal thing to put on the other team, and notice that average Elo is not necessary. But what sort of a party should we use to fill the 5th slot as his ally? Would it be a good idea to find a single guy who matches the lowest skilled player on the 4-stack? The highest?How would that guy appraise the match we made for him, being the best player in the game playing with a bunch of players far worse than he is, or the worst player, with players much better than he is? What if we cannot find a 4 stack that matches him well? Would it be a good idea instead to take two 2-stacks, one that match the top two players, and one that matches the bottom two? What is going to be their reaction to being put in such a match?


    What would you say is the optimal way to match a stack with a large spread in skill?

    The team opposing the stack should obviously have a higher average Elo since they can t communicate between them... The stack will know who is good and who is not so they ll put their lowest player on a support role and the best on solo mid or farming role so they alread yhave an advantage to the non stack where the lowest player for example might go mid...

    When there is a 4 stack the last player who joins them must be either on their average elo or the highest but definetely not the lowest... It sucks being in a 4 stack were the solo guy just ruins it all and throws, he must be able to comprehend the momentum of the game..

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by fletcher View Post
    What would you say is the optimal way to match a stack with a large spread in skill?
    Instead of the solo-mm-option implemented right now I would like to see a setting to limit the maximum acceptable skill spread for your matches. Only because a four-stack decided not to give a shit about balanced matchmaking does not mean they should be able to dictate the match-quality for everyone else involved. Let that stack wait for somebody who cares just as little as they do (= no skill spread limit set).

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by F2P View Post
    [ ] Faster queue times
    [ ] Bracketing

    Pick one.
    Bracketing.

    because....queing is at most 10-20mins.

    a fucked up game is 40mins.

    sure if you're a kid with too much time on your hands...like i once was...no issue.

    if you work and have 2-3 hours after work before you have to go to bed...big issue.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Kishin View Post
    Instead of complaining about matchmaking, you can actually do something about it by improving.
    so last hit, stacking, pulling, deny, warding, rotating/tpscroll, courier, healing/mechs/skill
    all done.

    what's next big fuck?

    is this 1v5 dota?

    its 5v5.

    so stfu piece of shit.

  10. #10
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    ^
    Pub DotA IS 1vs5(or 1vs9). Also insulting people isn't achieving anything. But I bet you've mastered all the things you've stated.

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