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Thread: Let me explain matchmaking to tbose of you who don't understand

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noo View Post
    There, you just saved me time. Here's the reason why this system is broken. New players will get carried by experienced players, experienced players will get drowned by new players = broken ratings.
    Please don't take words out of context, this reasoning is valid for players with "a few wins"! Of course 1-5 games cannot be representative (for the reason you quoted), but this is only a transient consequence of (many!) new players who just joined the game after it went out of beta. I also described how the algorithm will deal with them and why it's possible to cross them in your games from time to time. Eventually the ratings will settle; the real drawback of this system is the times it will take to get there (might be too much to bare for a few players, like the ones in these forums). IMO, it would be logical to avoid this situation as much as possible if you: a) wait for the "waters to settle", b) manage to hold as high a rating as possible, c) stack-up!
    Last edited by ego-Odin; 07-29-2013 at 03:11 AM.

  2. #22
    Basic Member nadaga's Avatar
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    I don't understand why i get games instantly every time and they seem to me like it gave me the first 9 random guys it found. It used to take 3 mins to find one.

    Explain !
    Last edited by nadaga; 07-29-2013 at 03:20 AM.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by comstrike View Post
    It works fine. I can see you have trouble explaining why you think it doesn't work.
    Fair enough. Allow me to produce a list.

    1. Perhaps the most important. It used to work. It used to work just fine. About 6 weeks to 1 months ago. Stomps were in the minority of games, ridiculous match ups in terms of wins were in the minority. I had never seen a person with over a 1000 wins, and rarely played with people less than 200. People around my level of experience. Now, it is not uncommon to see people (before Valve shat themselves and hid their cock up) with 1500 wins with, or against, people with 30 wins. Guess what? Quality of games went downhill incredibly rapidly.

    2. I, and a lot of people, especially I would say round my level of experience, just enough to understand the game, but not enough to be pro, are not enjoying it - just look on these forums. Games are either getting stomped, or stomping.

    3. The absense of any open skill progression/league system. IN my opinion, for an online multiplayer game that has been released, this is an unforgivable oversight.

    I bet you are a pretty experienced player. Upwards of 1500 wins. Most of the people on here singing the tune of the MMS is fine are. Why? Because you are good enough to hold your own with the best, and equally good enough to carry some less experienced players. Well, I'm neither, and I've had enough of this shit.
    We are Legion.

  4. #24
    Basic Member comstrike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slim.NZ View Post
    Fair enough. Allow me to produce a list.

    1. Perhaps the most important. It used to work. It used to work just fine. About 6 weeks to 1 months ago. Stomps were in the minority of games, ridiculous match ups in terms of wins were in the minority. I had never seen a person with over a 1000 wins, and rarely played with people less than 200. People around my level of experience. Now, it is not uncommon to see people (before Valve shat themselves and hid their cock up) with 1500 wins with, or against, people with 30 wins. Guess what? Quality of games went downhill incredibly rapidly.

    2. I, and a lot of people, especially I would say round my level of experience, just enough to understand the game, but not enough to be pro, are not enjoying it - just look on these forums. Games are either getting stomped, or stomping.

    3. The absense of any open skill progression/league system. IN my opinion, for an online multiplayer game that has been released, this is an unforgivable oversight.

    I bet you are a pretty experienced player. Upwards of 1500 wins. Most of the people on here singing the tune of the MMS is fine are. Why? Because you are good enough to hold your own with the best, and equally good enough to carry some less experienced players. Well, I'm neither, and I've had enough of this shit.
    1. My first post explains wins do not equal skill. In the last couple weeks, thousands of new players have been joining the game since beta ended. That 30 win player could have been someone who played HoN or is on a smurf account. It's really not that complicated.

    2. This forum is not indicative of "stomps." As of now, there are 5,168,717 unique players this month. This forum has 77,023 users. That means this forum represents less than 2% of the total population. Of that 2%, they are not all complaining about stomps. And if they were perhaps they should understand how this 5v5 game works: This is a 5v5 game with 100 different heroes and an extremely highly complex design which makes it literally impossible to eliminate stomps. The best you can do is match the teams up and go from there. The game doesn't know what hero you're going to pick before the game starts. The game doesn't know if you're going to choose carry, support, imitator, etc. The game doesn't know if you're team is going to pick 5 hard carries against an extremely strong gank/push line-up. There are tons of reasons there might be stomps.

    3. I've been promoting the need for a visible ladder/mmr forever. I'll agree with you on that.
    Last edited by comstrike; 07-29-2013 at 03:32 AM.

  5. #25
    Basic Member Megiddo's Avatar
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    The only reason you might come up with that broken theory is you're actually lucky enough in your current mm and do not encounter the issues the WHOLE community rages about.
    Its not just this forum. Its everywhere and you can actually look it up. I doubt you are the super dendi that can just carry any game regardless of how bad your team is so the only other variant left is you are lucky enough to get drafted most of the time in the side with the highest skilled players and you just play full stomp games.

    From all the games I played since the patch I pretty lucky as well. 2-3 of the games I get in the team with really good players which "coincidently" has the highest number of games played/wins and it just a sad/boring/pathetic stomp against a team where there is always only one person on par with our team in terms of skill/wins/lvl/games and the rest of his team consists of 10-15 wins/games played tards that have no clue how the use a mouse and keyboard.
    When the above does not happen. I get drafted into the other side, and I'm the one that plays with a team full of lobotomized monkeys vs the opposite team that has all 5 good players.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megiddo View Post
    The only reason you might come up with that broken theory is you're actually lucky enough in your current mm and do not encounter the issues the WHOLE community rages about.
    Its not just this forum. Its everywhere and you can actually look it up. I doubt you are the super dendi that can just carry any game regardless of how bad your team is so the only other variant left is you are lucky enough to get drafted most of the time in the side with the highest skilled players and you just play full stomp games.

    From all the games I played since the patch I pretty lucky as well. 2-3 of the games I get in the team with really good players which "coincidently" has the highest number of games played/wins and it just a sad/boring/pathetic stomp against a team where there is always only one person on par with our team in terms of skill/wins/lvl/games and the rest of his team consists of 10-15 wins/games played tards that have no clue how the use a mouse and keyboard.
    When the above does not happen. I get drafted into the other side, and I'm the one that plays with a team full of lobotomized monkeys vs the opposite team that has all 5 good players.
    How have you established that the WHOLE community rages about those issues? The WHOLE Dota community is literally millions of people, the amount of people that complain may not even be a hundred, and most of them give the impression that they will complain about everything. I, for one, am not complaining.

  7. #27
    Basic Member Megiddo's Avatar
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    Please check any dota related forum/reddit/w/e

  8. #28
    Basic Member comstrike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Megiddo View Post
    The only reason you might come up with that broken theory is you're actually lucky enough in your current mm and do not encounter the issues the WHOLE community rages about.
    Its not just this forum. Its everywhere and you can actually look it up. I doubt you are the super dendi that can just carry any game regardless of how bad your team is so the only other variant left is you are lucky enough to get drafted most of the time in the side with the highest skilled players and you just play full stomp games.

    From all the games I played since the patch I pretty lucky as well. 2-3 of the games I get in the team with really good players which "coincidently" has the highest number of games played/wins and it just a sad/boring/pathetic stomp against a team where there is always only one person on par with our team in terms of skill/wins/lvl/games and the rest of his team consists of 10-15 wins/games played tards that have no clue how the use a mouse and keyboard.
    When the above does not happen. I get drafted into the other side, and I'm the one that plays with a team full of lobotomized monkeys vs the opposite team that has all 5 good players.
    Nothing I have said is a "theory." It's how the algorithm works. If you don't solo queue, you are going to get a wide spread of players because of player stacks. If you join solo, you will be with your mmr, but it will take time for things to stabilize. It's really is not that hard to understand and the only way it can be fixed is with time. There are just too many new players joining at the moment.

  9. #29
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    Valveknights are blinded by the sun shining off from their armor. Like in the case of OP. Hurr Durr I did some math, MMR isn't broken guys, I did some math. Thousands of people writing their experiences regarding how broken MM is, but OP did some math and your experiences doesn't matter.
    Last edited by svc_385; 07-29-2013 at 04:32 AM.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by azrael109 View Post
    What you fail to understand is that Valve made up their own way to start out the elo, it doesnt start and goes by the normal rules. It starts somewhere (we dont quite know where) and then takes into account your KDA and other stats when determining how much ELO you get for the first bunch of games you play. IF you get lucky and gets a better team you might end up at 1700 HoN elo in 4 games even while beeing really really bad. Then you start to drop down by 5/lost game, where you will still get lucky from time to time and win some games. It will be a hell of a long time before you are actually where you are supposed to be.
    Any sources to support this "takes account your KDA and shit" claim?

    HAVING PROBLEMS WITH THE MATCHMAKING? MUTE SYSTEM? THINKING EVERYBODY IS INFERIOR TO YOU?
    WE HAVE THREE EASY STEPS TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR PROBLEM!


    THANK YOU FOR MAKING DOTA2 A BETTER PLACE! AND REMEMBER, THERES NO GOING BACK

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