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Thread: To everyone that thinks they're stuck in "ELO hell"

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by GermanViet View Post
    You need to learn how to read.

    He is 5.6k MMR on main account and he is "elo boosting" a 2.9k MMR account.
    He is making a experiment to see if he manages to bring that account to 5k+ MMR.

    Ofc games at <3k MMR are vastly unbalanced. He is playing with low skilled players.
    yes, I've read, and you need to realize that the system is making the unbalanced games, because it can not, even after 12 games, realize how skilled the player is ...

  2. #22
    Basic Member hoveringmover's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadKernel View Post
    yes, I've read, and you need to realize that the system is making the unbalanced games, because it can not, even after 12 games, realize how skilled the player is ...
    Indeed, if he's playing a wide variety of heroes, obviously there must be no question that he knows what he's doing compared to those he's playing with and against. There's no good excuse from Valve for why their matchmaking system is not more dynamic than how it is now.
    I will mercilessly add to my ignore list anyone that makes an incredibly annoying signature.

  3. #23
    Basic Member Heh_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadKernel View Post
    yes, I've read, and you need to realize that the system is making the unbalanced games, because it can not, even after 12 games, realize how skilled the player is ...
    After 150+ games, your MMR is supposed to be stable. It is not supposed to suddenly rise dramatically.

  4. #24
    Basic Member wachon1992's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heh_ View Post
    After 150+ games, your MMR is supposed to be stable. It is not supposed to suddenly rise dramatically.
    you get around 20 rate per win so in 5 games u raise 100 rate in 25 500 and 50 1k


  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadKernel View Post
    yes, I've read, and you need to realize that the system is making the unbalanced games, because it can not, even after 12 games, realize how skilled the player is ...
    What?
    So you expect there is a system which can determine your skill after 12 games? Tell me more about it.
    (Incase you pull up calibration games which only needed 10 games: The calibration phase uses your hidden MMR from unranked games which you unlock after ~150 games.)

    You don't suddenly go from 3k MMR to 5k MMR. You gain MMR by winning games. If he reached his spot his winrate should be close to 50% since everyone is somewhat equally skilled.

    I could have 10 "good" games and win all of them. And then play with the real pros where I will terribly feed. Having high MMR fluctuation is not good.

    Here is a picture provided by Valve:
    Spoiler: 


    The no prior experience graph is assuming you do improve with time. Ofc you cannot improve indefinitly. You someday hit your personal skill cap.

    And the prior experience graph is the graph which the player is currently taking. The first MMRs are very easy and he will get them pretty quickly. But the higher your MMR is the tougher are your enemies and your winrate goes down.
    The question however is whether he can reach 5k+ MMR which then tells whether "elo hell" is existing or not.
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  6. #26
    Basic Member Heh_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wachon1992 View Post
    you get around 20 rate per win so in 5 games u raise 100 rate in 25 500 and 50 1k
    He only won 14 games so he's still a long way away from getting it up to 5k MMR.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heh_ View Post
    After 150+ games, your MMR is supposed to be stable. It is not supposed to suddenly rise dramatically.
    that is a major flaw, because those 150 games could have played with friends, what happens when you start to play alone? this happens:
    Quote Originally Posted by BadKernel View Post
    the system is making the unbalanced games, because it can not, even after 12 games, realize how skilled the player is ...

  8. #28
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    There is Solo MMR and Party MMR.

    I should stop feeding the troll. I'm out.
    James "2GD" Harding's career as a Dota 2 host on Valve events
    * 25.02.16 - † 26.02.16
    Spoiler: 



  9. #29
    Basic Member rockonrob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoveringmover View Post
    Indeed, if he's playing a wide variety of heroes, obviously there must be no question that he knows what he's doing compared to those he's playing with and against. There's no good excuse from Valve for why their matchmaking system is not more dynamic than how it is now.
    Well, of course their system isn't more dynamic, the system in place assumes that only 1 person is using an account and that their skill will not change dramatically over the course of a few days (as is in this experiment). These are pretty fair assumptions, considering your skill does not fluctuate to an extremely degree, and therefor means the game is not based 90% on luck. The game is free, every person should be able to have their own account, and the game cannot determine what skill you be will playing with today even before you start playing. It assume it knows you and figures it can sort of understand how you have been playing, and thereby deciding who you should be playing with.

    Smurfs are detected in their first 75 games. MMR stabilizes in the next 75.
    I understand where you are coming from, you want to say that "This is like a brand new account that checked 'experienced', except that we can see the MMR. Why isn't smurf detection working, and his MMR rising like a smurfs would?"
    Well, I can't tell you the specifications for smurf detection, as no one truely knows how it works, or if is turned off after 75 games or so. It is GOOD that it is hard, if not impossible, for smurfs to be detected at greater "matches played" because shit happens. We don't want low elo players getting skyrocked up to the top elos because they got lucky a few games in a row or high levels players feeding on purpose and dropping to 2.5k elos just because smurf detection is always enabled.

    Some sort of "elo boosting" safeguard would be nice, but I don't think it has really been looked into much as of right now. If this experiment is successful, and there really is no elo hell, then "elo boosting" safeguards would be sort of irrelevant, as it would be proof that any player can freely move up and down the ladder as long as they have the required skill. Sure, you could get elo boosted, but then if you try to play at that level you would get stomped and thrown back down. And there is not public rating currently, so the number can only meaningful to friends, if they care at all. I think most players should be able to recognize a 5.6k elo player, or at least guess they should be up there, from just playing with them as long as they are trying. (as long as the skill difference is fairly vast)

  10. #30
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    Even after seeing this you still claim that MMR is broken... how delusional are you?

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