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Thread: Bots on human/player side being utterly useless

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rokit View Post
    but in the end I think making the player's bots more helpful should be the first priority.
    Agreed. Forbidding grouping is a kludge, and no solution. There's no need to forbid grouping if both sides play well and the player can interact with his team.

  2. #22
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    Bots have trouble understanding the human reaction so you have to work with them because they do kinda obvious stuff, that's why initiating is not good with them imo, you kinda have to let one of them stun so they trigger the rambo mode and then you do the engage because for some reason you stun doesn't trigger this mode especially under towers where bots suck the most.
    But i agree overall they are kinda stupid, they are always late to defend and sometimes they suicide for no reasons, waiting for the tower to die and then walk to their death happens once every game at least.

    I find them decent for bots in lane tho, sometime they freak out and do nothing but overall it's ok.

  3. #23
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    K I'm seriously pissed off. I'm trying to teach my friend who's new how to play DotA but I can't teach him if our bots are feeding (0-5 bottom lane within the first 10 minutes), not helping when pushing/defending (Zeus farming top), and not helping when I gank a lane (they sit at the tower and don't do anything).

    VS in particular does nothing; she doesn't ever use Magic Missle (except to last hit, of all things), and NEVER ONCE have I seen her swap anyone, enemy or ally.

    I think bots need to prioritize wherever the player pings, because this is really frustrating.
    Last edited by emailbox; 02-04-2012 at 04:16 PM.

  4. #24
    Basic Member PikaPika's Avatar
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    Why not just make it so you are allowed to have different difficulty for each side. Like Dire having Normal bots and Radiant having Easy bots. This might solve some of the problem of the bots on your side acting like derps all the times.

  5. #25
    Basic Member KevinCorporation's Avatar
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    I agree that the bots on the human side seem entirely brain-dead.
    In short, there is nothing "intelligent" in the ai.
    Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

    Steam Id: KevinCorporation

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Django View Post
    You are seriously claiming that easy bots play better than unfair bots?

    Not sure if trolling....

    I'm gonna play vs easy bots now and watch their uberganks
    I dunno if something has changed, but I played with a buddy of mine against bots, set to Easy, and they were denying creeps in our lane. I got harassed by both of the enemy bots in my lane. Mid roamed after 10-15 minutes and tried to gank. I get comboed by the stuns just the same as putting the bots on anything else. By comboed, I do of course mean that they wait til one is about to expire before they use another.

    Previously I did not play against the Easy bots(wasn't even a setting the first few times I played against bots, iirc). This was the first time and I assumed all of this was normal behavior... until I saw this thread. Could have been an isolated incident, so I will just play a few more by myself on Easy, but they were definitely doing everything on your list that they should not be doing(reaction times didn't seem like they were faster than they should be, seemed okay).

  7. #27
    Basic Member squinte's Avatar
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    I've actually seen a dofus allied Earthshaker feeding the opponents in an unfair match.
    He starts in a lane with me and dies 8 times in a row and enemy lane is super buffed. lvl 16 vs his level 6, I'm level 9. He just gets way too close and then basically can't get out with his 20hp left over from enemy abilities. He lays down a Fissure then forgets he's in the middle of two enemies and runs back and forth from creeps, to towers, to creeps, to enemy heroes, etc... Seems to be legit like real DotA feeders, but I digress.

    What I came to say was that I survive far more often than my allies during unfair matches, but on normal it's a different story. I've never tried easy because I figured I'm beyond that difficulty. I can honestly say on Unfair that it actually seems most fair because the bots, while not wise with their money, get more of it and are actually able to buy useful items despite their tendency to feed. It does seem to me that regardless of difficulty the team with a human player always full of far more goofy bots.

    Edit: I'd also like to mention if you see your team clumping up down lane when they say "pushing lane" I find that if you go into their huddle with them they will then proceed to push the lane. I assume it works the same when "defending"and they clump up behind structures instead of actually defending.

    I think this is because it's a team of 4 and they're waiting for the 5th bot to show up. Without the 5th bot they won't make their pushes or defenses because they're short a man. I think that's why you actually have to clump up with them because they are actually waiting for you, but you don't know that because you're not part of the hive mind haha.
    Last edited by squinte; 02-09-2012 at 10:23 PM.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by squinte View Post
    I think this is because it's a team of 4 and they're waiting for the 5th bot to show up. Without the 5th bot they won't make their pushes or defenses because they're short a man. I think that's why you actually have to clump up with them because they are actually waiting for you, but you don't know that because you're not part of the hive mind haha.
    Dear lord I need to try this out right away, it would make so much sense if this were true.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by squinte View Post
    I think this is because it's a team of 4 and they're waiting for the 5th bot to show up. Without the 5th bot they won't make their pushes or defenses because they're short a man. I think that's why you actually have to clump up with them because they are actually waiting for you, but you don't know that because you're not part of the hive mind haha.
    This could be the case with defending, but not pushing. I see the bots on my team pushing by themselves all the time. In fact, I think their pushing behavior is one of the reasons the enemy team gets so fed. They will push right up to a turret and then proceed to fight the entire enemy team right underneath it. They usually get wiped out in a matter of seconds while the enemy team has 1/4 to 1/2 of their health left. And since the enemy team always has a teleport scroll on hand, even on easy (I know of no beginners who do this haha), they are always ready to defend. IMO teleport scrolls should be a normal, unfair only behavior.

    As far as defending, I've seen 2 high level bots on my team cower away from about 15-20 creeps (no enemy heroes around) while they destroy the Ancient.

  10. #30
    Basic Member squinte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rokit View Post
    This could be the case with defending, but not pushing. I see the bots on my team pushing by themselves all the time. In fact, I think their pushing behavior is one of the reasons the enemy team gets so fed. They will push right up to a turret and then proceed to fight the entire enemy team right underneath it. They usually get wiped out in a matter of seconds while the enemy team has 1/4 to 1/2 of their health left. And since the enemy team always has a teleport scroll on hand, even on easy (I know of no beginners who do this haha), they are always ready to defend. IMO teleport scrolls should be a normal, unfair only behavior.

    As far as defending, I've seen 2 high level bots on my team cower away from about 15-20 creeps (no enemy heroes around) while they destroy the Ancient.
    I only mean when they do clump up and don't actually push when you're ahead of them. sometimes my bot team will just push in on their own in a lane I'm not even near and get totally destroyed. For instance, I'll be pushing top and they'll all jump into mid and push instead of helping me. If I see them clump up because I'm already pushing a lane and they're stuck around the corner behind me, I think they're waiting for me.

    I think sometimes if you're within range of them, they will decide to go push because you are near. If you're on the other side of the map, they might just go on their own. I don't really know to be honest. I just know that when they are clumping before pushes that if I go into the huddle they break out of it and move forward. I see a lot of times our rax are being raped and the bots on my team are hiding behind the ancient and I'm thinking, "wtf, you silly old bots?" I've never knowingly gone into their huddles when they're in the defensive clumps though, so I can't guarantee that it's the same case, but I suspect it is.

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