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Thread: matchmaking issues

  1. #41
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    Getting matched with new players seems to be a problem with being able to choose any skill level when you start. Not everyone is going to be honest.

  2. #42
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    I wish we could track our MMR so we could see our progress through the match ranking system. In general this could help players AND devs deal with the problems everyone's seeing. At least if we could see our progress we could come up with better ways, as a community to help good players progress out of low ratings and bad players progress down.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricTams View Post
    - We don't enforce a 50-50 win rate (Maybe we should?) instead we always try to make the best match possible. I'm always happy when I see someone with a win rate close to 50% though since it means that we haven't been skewing one way or the other in giving matches that were too hard or too easy. I totally agree with your desire to have fewer stomps though.
    OMG. Comment about forcing 50-50 win rate from a developer responsible for matchmaking is something scarry. Does he understand the mathematical model behind ideal matchmaking ? How can you build good MM if you don't know the basics ?

    For those who don't have math degree I'll explain that 50-50 win rate is by-product of mathematically correct MM and only in the long run. On the short run correct MM can significantly differ from 50-50 ratio.

    There is simple example. At the beginning bad player chooses expert skill level. He looses like 50 games before he's at his true rating and has 50% win chance. With ideal matchmaking he should always have ~50 more lost games than won games*( but with really high number of games n/(2*n+50) -> 0.5 ).
    If you force in any way 50-50 win ratio ( most probably MM in LoL is doing this ) than your MM isn't mathematically correct.

    * This example is a little bit simplified. But imho is close enough to give general idea.
    Last edited by hazeman; 03-22-2012 at 01:58 PM.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by hazeman View Post
    OMG. Comment about forcing 50-50 win rate from a developer responsible for matchmaking is something scarry. Does he understand the mathematical model behind ideal matchmaking ? How can you build good MM if you don't know the basics ?

    For those who don't have math degree I'll explain that 50-50 win rate is by-product of mathematically correct MM and only in the long run. On the short run correct MM can significantly differ from 50-50 ratio.

    There is simple example. At the beginning bad player chooses expert skill level. He looses like 50 games before he's at his true rating and has 50% win chance. With ideal matchmaking he should always have ~50 more lost games than won games*( but with really high number of games n/(2*n+50) -> 0.5 ).
    If you force in any way 50-50 win ratio ( most probably MM in LoL is doing this ) than your MM isn't mathematically correct.

    * This example is a little bit simplified. But imho is close enough to give general idea.
    When he says 50-50 win rate is not enforced, I think this is exactly what he meant.

  5. #45
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    Eric,

    I have the same qualms with matchmaking as the original poster. Have the devs considered adding a Concede button option?

    A stomp is no fun on either side, winning or losing, to invest 45 minutes into.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trapstarr View Post
    Eric,

    I have the same qualms with matchmaking as the original poster. Have the devs considered adding a Concede button option?

    A stomp is no fun on either side, winning or losing, to invest 45 minutes into.
    Please no... if the game was 45 mins it wasn't a stomp. I lost count of the number of games i've turned around while they are pushing our rax, if there was concede people would just give up and wait for the concede button to be available after they got firstblooded.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by ehtom View Post
    When he says 50-50 win rate is not enforced, I think this is exactly what he meant.
    But he says "maybe we should?". This suggest that he doesn't know why it would be bad.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by EricTams View Post
    - The outcome of a games is determined more by the best person on a team rather than the worst player. My assumption was originally the same as yours but I had to change my mind once I saw the stats showing otherwise.

    Cheers,
    Eric
    have you compared this at various elo intervals? I find it very hard to believe this would apply during higher skilled games, I usually notice bad eggs dragging teams down. Eventually you reach a ceiling where everyone is playing solid enough that being exceptional mechanically isn't enough to carry the team whilst someone doing exceptionally bad is disastrous.

  9. #49
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    I come from LoL and i chose mid lvl because before i got the key i just watched a shitload of vids to understand the game, i have +13 wins (mostly solo and a few duo so i never 5 men stack) or something and i am in high lvl games but i don't feel at all like a high lvl player or something, and some players are even worse than me. It depends on the game tho, like one game i played Riki it was high lvl in the ranking thing and they bought shitload of sentry and stuff against me and the game was interesting overall, i have some more like that with lots of wards some kind of brain with comps but i can do one game like that and the next one is complete shit where i play a support and we have two carries with 30 CS at the end of the game (true story) so i don't understand.
    Long story short i think the lvl braket is bugged.
    Also the 5 men stacks in the same Q as solo players is completly destroying the MM. Sometimes it's so obvious they are on voice and stuff with their tryhard comp like you start to dive one, two guys instant TP which almost never happen in normal games tbh no matter your skill lvl (based on what i see on pro streams when they play pub). That's really easy to win like that, when i duo i don't even duo with voice, i could try to bring 5 friends on Dota2 like me who never played before except LoL and be at +40/+50 while we all suck but with voice it's not even fair to solo players. And then these guys play solo and they suck too much for their rating and they ruin games for the actual good players. I think it's REALLY bad.

  10. #50
    Basic Member BenSkysong's Avatar
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    Since this influx of more beta keys.. I dare not solo or even 4 stack anymore. It has to be 5 stack..
    Because whenever I solo queue, I feel like...


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