Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 41

Thread: Manta with Bash

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Basic Member d.phoenixxx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,359

    Manta with Bash

    Now this has been a widely known issue in Dota 1.

    In Dota 1:
    Manta Style with passive Bash on a hero.
    If the original hero managed to trigger a Bash, the illusions from Manta Style will have a chance of extending that bash via "fake bashing".
    If the illusions "fake bash" while the original hero did not managed to trigger a Bash, nothing happens, the "fake bash" might even be extended in duration by the "real bash" from the original hero, meaning the target being hit is not stunned at all.

    Same thing happens with passives like passive Time Lock from Faceless Void, passive Bash from Slardar.


    I want to know, does Dota 2 have the same mechanics? Or do illusions not "fake bash" or bash at all?
    From my own testing with Anti-Mage in a test game and in a real game, they do not seem to perform the same way as in Dota 1. This means that illusions totally do not have the Bash ability and cannot "fake bash" either to extend the original bash.

    Can anyone confirm my results?
    Last edited by d.phoenixxx; 05-03-2012 at 03:06 PM.

  2. #2
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    224
    i can only confirm that while lolling around for 10 min with illusions with bashers we didnt manage to make them stun, nor extand a stun.

  3. #3
    Fake bash was corrected on Dota1 as far as i can remember.

  4. #4
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Romania
    Posts
    161
    Quote Originally Posted by DarknessMonk View Post
    Fake bash was corrected on Dota1 as far as i can remember.
    Was it? or is the site out of date? (http://www.playdota.com/mechanics/illusions)

    "Bash on Illusions

    Illusions may proc the skill Bash, however they will never deal any bonus damage, also the stun they place is "fake" because despite the animation the target can still move, also if another bash hits the unit while in this "Fake bash" state it will only prolong the fake buff, this is also true the opposite way, if a real unit bashes a target and then the illusion "fake" bashes the real bash will be prolonged."

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by xeno2wad View Post
    Was it? or is the site out of date? (http://www.playdota.com/mechanics/illusions)

    "Bash on Illusions

    Illusions may proc the skill Bash, however they will never deal any bonus damage, also the stun they place is "fake" because despite the animation the target can still move, also if another bash hits the unit while in this "Fake bash" state it will only prolong the fake buff, this is also true the opposite way, if a real unit bashes a target and then the illusion "fake" bashes the real bash will be prolonged."
    You're right, i think http://www.playdota.com/forums/showthread.php?t=439827
    Feels like Fake bashes works on MKB Heroes and natural bashers.

  6. #6
    Basic Member d.phoenixxx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,359
    So can any developer respond to this thread and tell us if "fake" bashing is "fixed" in Dota 2, or is this mechanic just overlooked and deserves some implementation?

    Because currently, it isnt uncommon to see melee carry heroes go Manta Style and Basher in a game, especially heroes like Anti-Mage and Riki.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by xeno2wad View Post
    Was it? or is the site out of date? (http://www.playdota.com/mechanics/illusions)

    "Bash on Illusions

    Illusions may proc the skill Bash, however they will never deal any bonus damage, also the stun they place is "fake" because despite the animation the target can still move, also if another bash hits the unit while in this "Fake bash" state it will only prolong the fake buff, this is also true the opposite way, if a real unit bashes a target and then the illusion "fake" bashes the real bash will be prolonged."
    Ok, so that explains the dota 1 state. And what about dota 2? Is this bug of wc3 engine is in dota 2 now too?
    It's rather non logic to make manta style, so your illusions could use orb affects from your items, but for some unknown reason not for normal bash =/

  8. #8
    Basic Member d.phoenixxx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    1,359
    As someone has highlighted, if an illusion doesnt "fake bash", it could be very apparant to the opposing team which is the real hero amongst illusions.
    It is also a matter of game balance, because I remember people specifically buying Manta because of the "fake bashing prolonging real bash duration" mechanic.

    Chairraider, as a Core Tester, could you highlight this to the developer team and ask them what is their perspective on this issue?

    I personally would think that this "quirky mechanic" could do a makeover, which is to say, "fake bash prolongs real bash", but "real bash will take precedence over fake bash and will not prolong a fake bash", meaning its a slight buff and legitimize the mechanic.

  9. #9
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    407
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowflame View Post
    It's rather non logic to make manta style, so your illusions could use orb affects from your items, but for some unknown reason not for normal bash =/
    Illusions only get one orb which is melee feedback. Every other orb has no or a purely visual effect. (Okay, crits work but a crit is not an orb.)

    Quote Originally Posted by d.phoenixxx View Post
    I personally would think that this "quirky mechanic" could do a makeover, which is to say, "fake bash prolongs real bash", but "real bash will take precedence over fake bash and will not prolong a fake bash", meaning its a slight buff and legitimize the mechanic.
    I don't think this will get implemented since it would make perma-bashes possible with cranium basher (which was the only reason why it was recoded: to insert the cooldown on bash).
    Last edited by apoptosis; 03-29-2012 at 07:59 AM.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by apoptosis View Post
    I don't think this will get implemented since it would make perma-bashes possible with cranium basher (which was the only reason why it was recoded: to insert the cooldown on bash).
    Its rather hard to permabash dring teamgights when your illusions get killed in 2 sec. Even during ganks it should be bkb+manta+basher+pt which is rather expensive gear so, not much of a problem i think. or at least make illusions real bash with cooldown like 3 or 2 seconds

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •