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Thread: Patch 7.08 suggestion: item changes, new combinations, passive gold and exp reworked

  1. #1
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    May 2015

    Lightbulb Patch 7.xx suggestion: item changes, new combinations, passive gold and exp reworked

    Hi, first i see that some of my suggestions for the 7.07 patch have been added to the game thank you! (

    Here are my suggestions to improve the game, with gameplay changes, new items, buffs and nerfs. I aim here for more balanced fights by making the game less punitive, the gameplay will still require skills in fight, positioning, etc.:

    Friendly gameplay changes:

    - Hand of Midas and tome of knowledge removed from the game. Instead players behind in net worth get more passive bonus gold, a passive exp gain is added. This change is made because a lot of players surrender and requested a surrender button after a bad start and now prefer to play in arcade 10vs10 to leave without penalty (and because we level up faster). To make the comeback much easier the game uses the ę Mario Kart system Ľ if you are behind instead of making the game worse and worse for you and force you to farm in the jungle, you get instead more passive gold and exp to make the entire game fair and PvP oriented during the entire match. Alternatively killing creeps could give more exp and gold to the last player and less to the player ahead. For the enemy with farm advantage it's not fun too because he knows he can then kill you without requiring a good skill in fight, like in an RPG just by right clicking and casting some spells on you. This also means that if someone in the game is playing farm simulator, you know that he won't get a clear advantage and that everyone in the game behind his GPM will get more passive gold and exp. This will discourage from farming all game long to snowball even more. This will also make supports more fun to play, they won't have to hide all the time behind a carry, they will get some items and abilities to fight or survive a gank more easily (it will make placing wards easier) and they will have more impact and encourage players to play them. Currently supports are just roaming food in the map.
    - Games should be faster, reaching level 25 should take in average 30 minutes like in 10vs10, currently it takes 40-45 minutes it's too long. Dota doesn't respect the rule of 15: 15 seconds to be understandable and what you need to do (well it's a MOBA so ok if it doesn't work), fun the first 15 minutes and for that it's not the case, the laning phase is the boring part and is too long, also very frustating you can die while your enemy needed one more hit to die and now you have an hard time laning and 15h to finish the game (I would say 15h should be enough to understand all the content of the game, for that it needs tutorials).
    - Tranquil boots removed from the game, each player has the passive rest ability: they heal for 3 % of their max HP after not attacking and receiving damage and not moving during 8 seconds.
    - Teleportation scroll removed from the game instead itís a channeling ability that every hero has and it can't be refreshed. Boot of travel to level 1 only, can teleport to an allied hero. Currently buying TP scroll after dying to get back in the lane is even more punitive and then you can't TP if the team is in trouble, generally it's the moment when players start trash talking, leaving (if no penalty) or afk jungling. Currently the backpack is mostly used to stack TP scrolls. The teleportation is an ability and is always available when respawing so you won't have to walk if you died two times in a row after teleporting in between.
    - Meteor Hammer removed from the game because it's an item for rats and bad supports, a support getting it in fight instead of a pipe, Mek, have a big chance of being useless. And because they don't have an high GPM they must focus on items useful in fights. And if a support wants to push and destroy buildings he can get necronomicons and drum of endurance.
    - Every heroe starts with boots and a set of tangoes this allow to make the boring beginning of the game a bit faster.
    - first blood doesn't give bonus gold.
    - you do not loose gold from dying so it will be less punitive if you join a fight and die while you were close to finish your item and this will encourage to help because it will be less punitive.
    - Courrier is bought automatically from the start and isnít available in the shop, wards are free.
    - More items should be available in the side shops.
    - Respawn time reduced by 15 %.
    - A cap must be added for the maximum cost of a single item like 2k gold, Sacred Relic at 3800 gold is too expensive to get the radiance safely. Players are discouraged to buy a nullifier if they have to fight a lot from an agressive team. Beside that Bloodthorn is the second most expensive item in the game but is the easiest late game item to build, it adds a lot of benefits like Mana Regen, good right click damage to int heroes, a strong disable; guaranteed crit and true strike for the entire team. I suggest that other items get inspired by the orchidís crafting.
    - There is two indispensable items in the game, maybe 3: boots, blink dagger and aghanimís scepter they should maybe have their own extra slot that are reserved for them.
    - Semi-backdoor protection (or Rat protection): Enemy towers get +30% resistance and 10 damage block if no heroe is at 2000 range from the building (to avoid rat), same applies to racks. Semi-backdoor doesn't work on shrines.
    - Fair RNG: chance based bashes and crits can't proc for the first physical hit on a new enemy hero target, if the target is reattacked under 5 seconds by a physical hit by the same player the hit could bash and/or crit.
    - denying a creep doesn't grant exp.
    - Every bashes abilities and items have a cooldown higher than the bash duration to avoid perma bashes.
    - Default game becomes a 6vs6 for more interesting team compositions and ganks that happens more often.

    Item changes:

    - Necronomicon: when I play a carry, for me the necronomicons are moving bounty rune that can instantly die with cleave and crit and are completely harmless with a Crimson Guard and/or a Shiva. So here is a big change: Their damage are too low and can be almost fully blocked and their BAT is low so the Shiva makes them attack in very slow motion. Here are the changes: damage restored to heroe type, they have 700/1000/1300 HP and 5/10/15 armor and a bounty of 50/100/150. Currently the archer does much less damage than the warrior because he has an higher BAT and no mana burn returned has damage and -10 damage. I suggest that both have 1.0 BAT, both in hero type damage (and the archer 125 damage at level 3 and warrior 135 damage at level 3). The Archer's Purge should instead be an ability like QoP Shadow Strike, it slows and does damage overtime (to compensate the lack of mana burn returned has damage) and have a low cooldown to pop Linkens, it's available at level 2, it doesn't remove positive buffs on the enemy.
    They always phase on the summoner and allied heroes. They have 40 % magic resistance and 40 % status resistance (to be less affected by the Shiva aura attack slow). Their high damage and EHP allow them to benefit more from a Vlad lifesteal. The melee has a new passive ability (still have last will and mana burn), his shield protects the summoner if it is at 300 range from him: if the summoner is attacked, the damage he receive are reduced by 30 % and 15 % of the damage are dealt to the necronomicon warrior as pure. Duration: 20 seconds to avoid splith pushes Cooldown: 35 seconds.
    - Crimson Guard: the active blocks cleave. It works on necronomicons. 25 seconds cooldown, can be affected every 25 seconds, duration 12 seconds.
    - Aghanim's Scepter: reduce the cast animation of every spells by 50 %.
    - Refresher Orb: the item should give some mana pool instead of just mana regen because after using the item we have not enough mana to recast our spells. Also the active should cost 300 mana and not 375.
    - Lotus Orb: when active adds 10 % magic resistance.
    - Buckler: gives 4 armor and 3 armor aura permanent.
    - Dagon: applies a 2 seconds blind.
    - Radiance: much easier to buy. Burn aura reduced to 50, adds +20 burn damage per stack on each attack, last 5 seconds. +20 movement speed.
    - Nullifier: much easier to buy.
    - Aeon Disk: reworked: is triggered at the fatal point, HP canít go bellow 1 and when active grants 40 movement speed and phase. Duration equal to the Blink Dagger disabled cooldown: 3 seconds. Cooldown: 80. Passive: 30 % status resistance.
    - Yasha: +25 % turn rate speed.
    - Sange: Maim applies -25 % turn rate speed.
    - Sange and Yasha 2: Greater Maim applies -50 % turn rate speed. 20 stats and 20 % movement speed. +50 % turn rate speed.
    - Echo Sabre: -100 % turn rate speed during the duration of the movement slow.
    - Echo Sabre level 2: does 2 attacks after your main attack, each attack applies the slow and turn debuff.
    - Helm of the dominator: make you immune for 1 right click bash before it is set on cooldown for 5 seconds. Gives 10 all stats, 10 armor to the owner and summoned. Can dominate a creep.
    - Drum of Endurance: grants aura phase when active. New passive: controlled units copy the MS of the summoner if higher than them.
    - Mjollnir: a lighting strike gives unobstructed vision arround the enemy hit by the lightning allowing it to bounce more effectively especially in the jungle.
    - Rod of Atos: faster projectile, the root applies a 100 % turn speed slow.
    - Rod of Atos 2: after the 2 seconds root a 2 seconds leach is applied (without turn speed slow).
    - Kaya: added 10 % cooldown reduction.
    - Veil of discord: uses Cloak + Ring of Regen instead of Helm of Iron Will. It gives 15 % magic resistance with 3 HP regen.
    - Vladimir's Offering: 5 armor aura instead of 4.
    - Hood and Pipe barrier last 15 seconds instead of 12. 15 percent status resistance while the barrier is active.
    - Eul: instant turn rate (turning the heroe is instantanous) and turning speed debuff have no effect. Cyclone: does 50 damage to the enemy on landing + 5x strength points.
    - Halberd disarm duration on melee of 3.5 seconds instead of 3 seconds because the duration is shorter than hex, without the silence, mute and guaranteed movement slow. Disarm range increase to 800 instead of 600 to counter dragon lance and to save an ally from Faceless Void.
    - Clarities gives mana 1.25 times faster but are shorter in duration and cost 60 gold.
    - Scypthe of Vyse: base movement speed 120 when hexed.
    - Desolator: armor reduction at 4, -1 armor per attack. Cap at -20 armor. Illusions and other heroes can stack it too.
    - Silver edge: break duration 4 seconds.

    New combinations:

    - Battlefury + crystalys: gives cleave and random critical hit ideal on melee against illusions and pushers.
    - Aether Lens + Kaya: gives damage amplification and cast range and 10 % cooldown reduction, ideal for Intelligence carry.
    - Vladimir's Offering + Crimson Guard: gives lifesteal aura and an active damage block ideal for summoners and supports.
    - Helm of the dominator + Drum of Endurance: gives attack speed, armor aura and movement speed aura ideal for summoners.

    New items:

    - A new item for ranged heroes, passively grants 40 attack speed. When active the heroe will attack the target and be able to move while attacking it's similar to Windranger's Focus Fire. The item can be combined with Dragon Lance.

    Hero buffs:
    - Alchemist: acid spray reduces the armor by 1 every second in the area, starts at -1/2/3/4 armor, when out of the area the armor negation continues 2/3/4/5 seconds after, then it's removed.
    - Arc Warden: the movement slow applied by Flux when not muted is added has bonus movement speed to Arc Warden (each independently, one bonus for the double when he casts it and one by the original). So it reduces the movement by 60 % at level 4 to the enemy and gets 60 % bonus movement speed.
    - Beastmaster: hawk has 75% evasion (overall it's a nerf because invisibility was more powerful but currently the hawk is too easy to kill).
    - Brewmaster: warriors have 0.7 BAT, armor 5. Dispel magic changed by movement and attack speed aura. Demolish changed by bash chance. Cooldown: 80, Aghanim cooldown: 35.
    - Chen: Holy Persuasion grants an aura movement speed of 10/15/20/25. Aghanim makes this passive global.
    - Doom: he is useless without his ultimate so most of the time he is farming waiting for it. I suggest to reduce the power of his ultimate and to reduce his cooldown so it can gank more often. A cooldown of 90 and damage per second of 20/35/50, cast range 500.
    - Dragon Knight: Corrosive Breath does 5 armor reduction for 5 seconds instead of 20 damage per second. Level 20 talents: 2x Dragon BloodDragon Blood HP Regen/Armor or Dragon Blood unbreakable (break from Silver Edge doesn't remove his passive).
    - Jakiro: burn damage 5/10/15/20.
    - Nyx becomes an Int heroe, Mana Burn does also 40/60/80/100 base mana burned to allow him to nuke heroes with low int like Troll Warlord.
    - Pangolier: his passive applies break too.
    - Pugna: Life Drain 200 damage + 5 percent max HP as magical damage.
    - Troll Warlord: I imagine his bash like the battery assault of Clockwerk, it has 40% chance to proc and does a 0.1 second stun.

    Hero nerfs:
    - Faceless Void: timelock does no bonus damage. Level 25 +100 chrono AoE instead of +175.
    - Clinkz: Strafe: 80/110/140/170 attack speed, his ultimate can't eat a necronomicon.

    New aghanims and changes:
    - Alchemist: 30 % damage resistance, ultimate's cooldown reduced by 15 sec: 40 sec instead of 55.
    - Beastmaster: having an high cast range with aghanim is useless, the time you reach your enemy only 2 seconds of stun are remaining, if you need a ranged disabler get Hex it will add 3.5 seconds of disable for a total of 4+3.5 = 7.5s with an high range that can't be silenced, has a lower cooldown and can trigger a linken to use his ultimate after. Hex and his ultimate allows him to disable two ennemies at once. Dragon Knight has a 5 seconds stun (level 25) with a 11 seconds cooldown (not mentioning his 40 armor) while Beastmaster has a 4 seconds stun with a 70 or 45 (with agh) seconds cooldown. I suggest to reduce his cooldown: 70/65/60. Aghanim changes the cooldown to 30 seconds, increase the cast range to 950, gives 50 % movement speed bonus (to him and his summon, without agh it gives 30 % movement speed to him and his summoned), you get true strike against the stunned enemy and break.
    - Bristleback: his build consist on getting the most EHPP possible and the aghanim doesn't contribute to that enough compared to an Heart of Tarrasque, Crimson Guard, Shiva, Octarine (not a lot more HP than Aghanim but spell steal added), Guardian Greaves and Blademail. That is why we see the aghanim rarely bought by him. What bristleback wants is to get has much tanky as possible and apply as much stack as possible on ennemies to damage and spell steal. That's why I suggest on top of having AoE nasal goo to have more range for his quill with +25 damage per stack (instead of the talent) to spell steal from every enemies in a bigger area and be able to reach enemies with dragon lance. And maybe an ability to dig in the ground an goes into the hole to have his back facing all direction, he becomes unable to move.
    - Dragon Knight: permanent dragon form this has been asked for years and will solve his farming issue. The aghanim also gives him a 30 bonus movement speed.
    - Pugna: Life Drain: 250 magic damage and 10 % ennemie's max HP as magic (before reduction). Cooldown removed. The 10 % max HP to heal an ally doesn't work.
    - Slardar: Slardar's ultimate becomes an AoE effect and steal 50 % of the amount of armor reduced with his ultimate (level 3 ultimate grants him +10 armor per enemy under corrosive haze).
    - Storm Spirit: Ball Lightning cost 30 mana + 4 percent of max mana instead of 8 % with aghanim.
    - Tinker: can rearm while walking, -20 % mana loss reduction.

    For the new heroes here is the type of gameplay I want to see the most (in the order, the most waited at the top):
    _ another multi heroes that are permanent like Meepo (not like Arc Warden and Terrorblade), that's what I am waiting the most.
    _ ability to switch between ranged and melee quickly like Troll Warlord is very fun, another heroe like that would be good.
    - spammable abilities that make your hero more powerful like the auill spray and ultimate of bristleback and the passive of Lina, Troll and Ursa.
    _ I like high mobility heroes that can kite, goes in the fight and escape, they are very good to play with and enjoyable to watch in replays.

    New game options:
    - you can enable a new option to be unable to move while channeling (for example Sand King's ultimate or Tinker's rearm (if no aghanim)) but can cancel it with the "s" key. This allow to not cancel it by mistake. Every actions you do like clicking and using items like blink dagger will be automatically queued (only one action queued if Shift isn't pressed).
    Last edited by Linko; 04-12-2018 at 08:03 AM.

  2. #2
    Basic Member
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    Aug 2017
    There need a Nerf on Helm of Dominator MS creep.

    Also can i suggest hero buff on CHEN's Creep
    1) Holy Persuasion add small MS boost on creeps like 5-10 per level. Example 5MS,10MS,15MS,20MS
    2) Hero Talents on Chen add Creep Attack speed/Attack damage with MS boost by a lot.
    3) Holy Persuasion Creep follow Chen's MS. Example Chen MS is 300 all creep under him is 300, if Chen MS is 400 all creep under him is 400.

  3. #3
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Yes Chen is missing an aura for his creep to make him more powerful, adding a movement speed aura would be great, a passive drum for him. Having the creep copying his movement speed is great too, maybe with a talent or item buff. I suggest 10/15/20/25 MS aura for holy persuasion, this passive becomes global with aghanim. Drum grants passive copy max movement speed of the heroe on the summoned units and the active grants phase aura to all.

    I have also edited my post and added a lot more suggestions. I have added three new concepts: cast animation reduction (aghanim's scepter), cleave protection (crimson guard's active) and turn rate modification (sange and yasha for example).
    Last edited by Linko; 02-01-2018 at 09:05 AM.

  4. #4
    Basic Member sureis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012


    kaya, magic immune blink from +force staff, or +cloak to something, or plus relic and pierce magic immunity
    Last edited by sureis; 04-01-2018 at 01:40 PM.

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