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Thread: "Easier" Bots don't seem to be easy enough for learning purposes

  1. #1
    Basic Member Kakkoii's Avatar
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    "Easier" Bots don't seem to be easy enough for learning purposes

    I've been trying to get some friends who play LoL, into playing Dota 2. And starting out in Bot matches with them is an obvious choice. But.. it seems not so much these days.

    I remember much earlier in the beta, when the bots weren't as refined, that they would be quite derpy on Easy setting, being fairly easy to win against and not playing against you aggressively. But now, even on the "Easier" setting, the bots play quite aggressively and will push lanes quite early. And two times in a row, there was a vengeful spirit roaming to our top Jungle/Lane to gank, before any creeps had even spawned (one time it was a hair away from successful against one of our derpy bots). Why is that kind of behavior happening on the easiest setting??

    Now I'm not saying they are super hard or anything, but for a player coming from LoL, it would be nice to have a quite easy bot setting that they can take their time with and get the basics of this game down with first, instead of becoming frustrated from being killed by bots and not feeling like playing the game anymore because of it.

    The "Easier" bots are harder than a lot of random live games one might play in, simply due to the bots being able to communicate so well compared to a lobby of jumbled players who may or may not be newish players.

    (And I know, some may say, "well, how will they learn if it's not challenging", but they will. Because having easy bots like that is merely about allowing a person to easily grasp the basic gameplay concepts without becoming frustrated. Then as they get comfortable with it and start liking the game, they will move on to the harder bots and learn to actually play well.)

  2. #2
    Basic Member xXSynXx's Avatar
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    this is the basic thing you need to learn about dota. Dota is hard! just kid

    anyway, agree on OP though. bot behaviour should be set easier/simpler for new player to get a grasp of playing dota.so +1
    "Knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit, but Wisdom is knowing not to put it in a fruit salad."

  3. #3
    Basic Member TheWilder's Avatar
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    Yeah, Easier bots should be realy bad. I agree OP

    +1
    Quote Originally Posted by vladhood View Post
    boy im glad all these qualified and educated game designers have come to the forums to help dota 2 grow

  4. #4
    Valve Developer
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    OP: Were you playing a coop matchmade game vs bots, or a private lobby?

  5. #5
    Basic Member Kakkoii's Avatar
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    A private lobby with the friend.

  6. #6
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    I agree that bots can be really annoying even on very easy difficulties. For instance, VS + jugg bots on easier difficulty will swap you on sight into Jugg then stun you, and Jugg will bladestorm you, all with perfect timing, every time you show up. That's 1000+ damage at level 6. Bane is equally as annoying and doesn't leave a chance to the player even at Easier and perfectly chains his spells together.

    For a new/noob player that's a guaranteed death every time he shows up in the lane. And a guaranteed uninstall LOL. +1

    As a suggestion, I would add a "human" factor to the bots. That means, give the bots a respond time before they actually do their things, as humans do. That could be a random number between 0.00 and 1.00 second, or something like that, and would vary according to difficulty.

  7. #7
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    A chance to screw up spell cast order, or missing skillshots more frequently, and less teamwork.

    They clump up as a team of 5 and combo like madmen.

  8. #8
    Basic Member Octagone's Avatar
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    I totally agree. When I was learning the game, Zeus always getting kills when I was low on health and VG and Sven stun locking, almost got me to quit the game. Thankfully I had some friends to teach and play with me so I could learn the game.

  9. #9
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    Sounds like we need to add more Easy mode hooks, right now it's not all that different from Normal. Good feedback, that's the kind of thing that's hard to gauge internally -- thanks everyone.

  10. #10
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    Agreed. I was going to post a topic about the difference between Passive and Easier being really quite a leap and bounds difference.

    I came from League of Legends to give DOTA 2 a fair shake since I really didn't like all the nay saying I kept hearing one way or the other on the LOL forums.
    Once I got an actual handle on last hitting/denial, DOTA 2's items, the difference in playstyle approach versus LoL (much longer laning phase, holding off aggression from the start, the entire learning curve versus a cliff) then I've basically been able to cream passive mode once I manage to feed myself on gold enough to start pushing down all the towers since, well, doesn't seem like the AI does much at all.

    I've played a few easier and normal matches; it can be hard to tell. So if you can do those hooks I'm sure it'll help myself and those I invite to sign up for the beta from LoL more.

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