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Thread: No seriously, this game absolutely NEEDS a blacklist.

  1. #1
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    No seriously, this game absolutely NEEDS a blacklist.

    The one thing this genre needs and none of the other games in it haven't implemented yet, is a blacklist. DotA 1 had a ban list (or rather the bots that hosted games would ban your IP and auto kick you if you tried to join.) and there is an obvious reason for it. This game gets heated. People love to intentionally ruin matches just to get a rise out of people. While I know there IS a report system, the fact of the matter is that reporting an intentional game ruin-er from one game isn't going to prevent him from being able to join up and ruin the next game (quite possibly with some of the same people from the last game).

    The ONLY counter argument I've heard against blacklisting is MMR abuse via blacklisting good players. However, the LEAST that could be done is a matchmaking mode where the 'ranking' doesn't matter and you CAN blacklist people so you don't have to put up with them ever again in that mode.

    All I'm saying, you want to fix the problem with this genre? Then you need to be able to give the power to block from playing with certain people to the player. The pros far outweigh the cons.

  2. #2
    Basic Member MaxBeoulve's Avatar
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    No, use search function. There are obvious reasons why this should not get implemented.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxBeoulve View Post
    No, use search function. There are obvious reasons why this should not get implemented.
    And yet you listed none. Again, there NEEDS to be a queue that has a blacklist. Leaving no option for the player to prevent abuse is a terrible idea.

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    Basic Member MaxBeoulve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proskub View Post
    And yet you listed none. Again, there NEEDS to be a queue that has a blacklist. Leaving no option for the player to prevent abuse is a terrible idea.
    Long queues, even longer queues for someone in a party, is a weapon in the hands of trolls and ragers, its very unlikely that you'll find the same player in a match....
    And many more for which I am lazy to search through the forums.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxBeoulve View Post
    Long queues, even longer queues for someone in a party, is a weapon in the hands of trolls and ragers, its very unlikely that you'll find the same player in a match....
    And many more for which I am lazy to search through the forums.
    So basically everything that could be fixed by having two queues, one with a blacklist and one without. Did you even read my post? I'm gonna wager you did not.

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    Basic Member bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxBeoulve View Post
    Long queues, even longer queues for someone in a party, is a weapon in the hands of trolls and ragers, its very unlikely that you'll find the same player in a match....
    And many more for which I am lazy to search through the forums.
    Although I agree with most of your post one point you're not entirely correct on which is the chance of meeting the same person 2 games in a row is VERY HIGH if you requeue as soon as the first game ended

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    Quote Originally Posted by Proskub View Post
    While I know there IS a report system, the fact of the matter is that reporting an intentional game ruin-er from one game isn't going to prevent him from being able to join up and ruin the next game (quite possibly with some of the same people from the last game).
    I don't understand this. Why is this bad? Do you suggest that you will be banned for ever when you do one bannable offense?

  8. #8
    Basic Member bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxBeoulve View Post
    Long queues, even longer queues for someone in a party, is a weapon in the hands of trolls and ragers, its very unlikely that you'll find the same player in a match....
    And many more for which I am lazy to search through the forums.
    Although I agree with most of your post one point you're not entirely correct on which is the chance of meeting the same person 2 games in a row is VERY HIGH if you requeue as soon as the first game ended

    Quote Originally Posted by Proskub View Post
    So basically everything that could be fixed by having two queues, one with a blacklist and one without. Did you even read my post? I'm gonna wager you did not.
    Having two queues would make the queue time even longer by splitting the player base into two different queues what exactly didn't you understand?

  9. #9
    Basic Member Automedic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Proskub View Post
    The ONLY counter argument I've heard against blacklisting is MMR abuse via blacklisting good players. However, the LEAST that could be done is a matchmaking mode where the 'ranking' doesn't matter and you CAN blacklist people so you don't have to put up with them ever again in that mode.
    People won't play this mode. If you really encounter that many assholes in your games that you want to join an entirely new, unranked queue in order to get a match without them chances are that you just an asshole yourself - sorry, mate.

    So given that your suggested mode won't be implemented (honestly, it would distill a certain part of the community and I'm damned sure I don't want to be part of it), as 1) Valve surely doesn't want to exclude out paying customers and 2) it would either A) further split the community in case it's a frequented mode, decreasing the average MM quality and increasing matching times or B) be utterly useless in case nobody plays it.

    And in case someone brings up the good old "let's implement a blacklist in normal matchmaking" idea I just take the liberty of doing a little Forum necromancy, summoning my response to these suggestions from days long gone past.

    *whispering some kind of satanic incantation* RISE, CLEVER ARGUMENT, RISE! *maniac laughing*

    Quote Originally Posted by Automedic View Post
    A personal banlist won't work either because I've experienced it often enough that I found myself in a game with a player I used to remember from a game before - where he failed ridiculously. With the inevitable "Oh my god, we gonna lose this for sure" on my mind I found that said player actually wasn't that bad, he just had a bad run the game before. Long story short: You cannot judge a player's average skill/behaviour by just playing one game with him. If you add the option to blacklist others there will be 3% people who violated rules on your personal blacklist and 97% people you just consider bad - trust me.
    Besides, blacklisting will horribly distort the matchmaking. It's only logical that you don't allow people blacklisted by you in either team on your game (as Irrelevante said, a double standard if you do). Now you have 10 players on a match each of whom has a personal blacklist, of course with players almost exclusively of their skill bracket. Now if the MM system starts with two empty teams the player base to choose from to create a balanced match decreases extremely with every new player you add to the game, due to their blacklist. In the end you will have a game unbalanced as fuck because the MM system just doesn't have enough players to ensure the balanced skill level in the game can be maintained.
    Last edited by Automedic; 07-16-2012 at 02:30 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Automedic View Post
    People won't play this mode. If you really encounter that many assholes in your games that you want to join an entirely new, unranked queue in order to get a match without them chances are that you just an asshole yourself - sorry, mate.

    So given that your suggested mode won't be implemented (honestly, it would distill a certain part of the community and I'm damned sure I don't want to be part of it), as 1) Valve surely doesn't want to exclude out paying customers and 2) it would either A) further split the community in case it's a frequented mode, decreasing the average MM quality and increasing matching times or B) be utterly useless in case nobody plays it.

    And in case someone brings up the good old "let's implement a blacklist in normal matchmaking" idea I just take the liberty of doing a little Forum necromancy, summoning my response to these suggestions from days long gone past.

    *whispering some kind of satanic incantation* RISE, CLEVER ARGUMENT, RISE! *maniac laughing*
    Theres a ranked and unranked mode in every other game in this genre. Why exactly would no one play the unranked mode? In fact, most people prefer an unranked mode if you look at LoL as an example.

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