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Thread: General Matchmaking Feedback Thread [READ OP]

  1. #121
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    - Sharing announcers.
    I love this, keep this around. Its actually exciting to try new voices for free in this way, and it got me to buy the Bastion voice cause it sounded so awesome.
    Feels good knowing other people notice when I try really hard to be nice, keep it around, maybe increase the limit a little so I dont feel so stingy commending nice guys.

    - people who dont communicate at all
    This is insane. It ruins the team based atmosphere when one player is not communicating and pinging everyone else on the team as if they are in charge. "No Mr Rus, I will not dive on their tower just because you are pinging a lot. We are outnumbered, underleveled and you have no english skills"

    By pinging I mean when you hold alt and click on the map.

    TO FIX IT:Make players match english words to silhouettes or pictures of the words. Might be hard to design an interface around this.

    Alternatively: Mic Only options, for people who actually want to play on a team as a team, not just waste 30 minutes trying to kill steal and pad your score for ratings. Punish bad communication extra in this game.

  2. #122
    This is my first time posting here so I do hope Valve gets my attention . Anyway I've been playing DotA for about 6 years now & DotA 2 since a little after the first International, just to give you a rough estimate of my experience with the game. Here are my likes & dislikes of the current Matchmaking system & some thoughts on all the hoo-hah that is going on with the Dotabuff Ranking right now.

    - After a little over 1k games under my belt, I'd say the skill balance between teams is pretty equal. I can say this is true because a perfectly balanced MMR system would more often than not ensure your Win-Loss ratio to be at about 50%. In many games I have played solo queuing, I found that it is a coin-flip situation when it comes to the skill level between teams.
    - Pretty fast and reasonable queuing time.
    - In game microphone.
    - Mute button.

    - Leavers. I think Valve should enforce more strict rules on this whole abandonment issue. People who abandon when they have given up on the game should be punished more strictly. Because when they do, they waste not only their time, but 9 other players and they ruin the spirit of the game which was what the problem was back in DotA 1. I think this is the most important issue Valve needs to address, next to flamers, ragers, whiners that pulls down the morale of the team ( but I guess that's what the mute button is for ).

    Now, coming to the issue of the Dotabuff Ranking and our hidden MMR ELO. I completely disagree with an individualistic MMR system that is based upon K/D ratios, or even K/D/A ratios for that matter. DotA is a team game, so at the end of the day what matters is if your TEAM wins or not. Everything in between is a little irrelevant, because your skill is gauged in relation to your teammates, and how much of a team player you are etc. as opposed to being a solo player.

    Thus, I hope Valve will create a MMR system that is gauged on your skill in relation to your team, and not as a solo player. Or even based on your proficiency in certain heroes.

    Just my 2 cents.

  3. #123
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    - Relatively fast matching
    - Relatively balanced teams most of the time
    - Confident in having about 50% chance of winning regardless of match history and winrate.

    - No context surrounding games. With no risk-reward (public rating, spoils of war) the games can become dull after playing for a while.
    Solution: Tournament mode. For example a 3-round single-elimination tournament firing whenever enough people queue for it, or a tournament launching every 30 minutes. MMR can be used to make sure the skill level of participants is roughly equal in fixed-size tournaments, or match similarly-skilled teams against eachother in the first rounds in open tournaments. Having to play more than one game with the same team would also be good incentive to work on teamwork and good relations with the rest of the team.
    - Sometimes there are large differences between certain aspects of skill between players and this creates lopsided games where the winner is decided seemingly at random, even if the overall skill of each player is about the same. If everyone on a team are good at teamwork they're likely to win even if their mechanics are lacking a bit. If only one player is good at teamwork his team is more likely to lose. Sometimes a player with strong mechanics can carry his team to victory alone, but other times the other team has enough strategic sense to be able to shut him down before he's a threat.
    Solution: Track different skills such as mechanics, teamwork, game awareness and strategy and use those in matchmaking.

  4. #124
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    What I like about matchmaking
    • It is simple, just press find match and a match will appear - can't be any more easy than that.
    • It is fast. Sometimes one have to wait 5 seconds and sometimes up to 5 minutes but usually within 2 or 3 minutes which I think is a great amount of time. It also gives the time to consider if I really want to play or not, sometimes I've changed my mind during the search time.
    What I don't like
    • I am a very competitive person, and I do my best to win at all times, one way of winning in a team game which relies alot on information is to communicate. I get the general feeling that alot of people aren't able to speak english even though I que in EU west mainly and sometimes both west and east.
    • I don't like that sometimes the skill level of my team mates and enemies are completely fine, but more often than not some people are just way below the rest of the field, it makes for an unfair game - for either team.
    • I don't like running into 2-3-4-5 man stacks when I solo que.
    What to do about it?
    • Well, some sort of filter, to be able to chose not to play with people from X,Y,Z countries etc, based on IP. For example I know that most russians, germans etc have very low english skills and therefore if I don't match up with them the risk of having a team of five that is able to speak english is higher
    • Regarding the skill level I have no clue, of course people can have bad games, try new heroes etc. thats not my main problem. But it's obvious when they are arrogant and act childish and ruin the game on purpose and don't want to listen for improvements or communicate that they are just on a lower level. I think some sort of ladder could help with this. For people who, who doesn't play in a pro team but when play like the game to be as close to a real competitive game as possible. For me that's how Dota should be played.
    • Being able to chose to just play against other solo ques when finding games would be nice, it would be fair to everyone solo queing. The risk of being in a 15 min stomp game would decrease alot.

  5. #125
    - Solo queue does a generally good job of matching me with same skill team mates and opponents

    - Group matchmaking effects my matchmaking in solo queue. If I'm helping a friend learn how to play, we're gonna lose a lot of games. I'd really like to be able to teach newer players without suffering in solo queue (or even regular teams)

    to improve that, just have a separate rank for every group of players you play with, initially base of off the solo queue rank, but don't have it effect solo queue, or other team rankings. Kinda like starcraft 2 does

  6. #126
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    I think matchmaking right now is great.
    I can try new hero, play with shitty friends. without worrying about anything. Matches are matched well in terms of skill.

    I'd like to see a ranking system(Not the shit DotaBuff was pushing), but in normal match making where I can be trying new things, teaching friends ranking needs to stay out.

    Also I feel a personal ranking is stupid, esp in a team game. So ranking only for teams, I'd like to see team have more then 6 spots for players. ^ is nicer for pros but it would be nice to have 9 slots so I can fit all my friends So we don't have to team swap.
    Last edited by Bagel; 01-26-2013 at 04:17 PM.

  7. #127
    - it finds game, so i can play dota2.. thats all i like about it
    - The quality of the games is very poor. Either we get stomped or we stomp the enemy. I never have close, balanced games that go very late game.
    - According to i was in higher platin ranking. So i am in the top 15% of the players. But still i get alot of new players, that dont know how the game is played. They dont farm as carry, they dont support as supporter, they dont initiate as tidehunter/magnus/sk. They dont pick smart at all.
    Or its just the stompgame and no matter what we do, the enemy runs into us to die and we just win in 30mins 50-10.
    Solution: In LoL you have to be level 30 to start the 'real matchmaking.' Before its just casual and learning the game. I would love to have this in Dota2 as well. I dont want to carry new players and tell them nonstop via voicechat what they have to do. So why even take them into consideration for higher skilled players? New players play with new players and skilled players want balanced, interesting games.

    - Language problems: Communication is the most important aspect to play this game at a decent level. Its hard to communicate with russians or brazilian guys if they dont try to speak english. If you beg them to talk english you get flamed as "american nazi", "blyad, suka" ect ect. Is that even necessary?
    Solution: Add language selections to chose from. In english you dont need cyrillic letters at all, so dont allow them. Also its not too hard to make an auto reporting system to check if the language spoken is english.

    For me as experienced player the pubs are just the worst ever seen. Every other game has some sort of rating and understands, that experienced players dont want to babysit new players. And new players dont want to get flamed or stomped by good players.
    Why would you even put them together at all? I prefer to wait 3mins for a good game instead of waiting 2 mins for a stomp.

  8. #128
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    -It works and saves a million headaches of trying to start a game
    -It only takes a handful of games to get relatively ranked appropriately- there is almost no 'MMR grinding'
    -As long as I queue into All Pick I avoid team stacking pretty well (but if I uncheck it I get max search bars for an entire region and then it doesn't do a good job anymore)
    -No Surrender/Concede is awesome, the little fights that the availability of giving up gives are mostly gone!
    -No stats is awesome, don't give-in to people's desires to see their stats / lookup mine - it has no bearing on their play in their current game so they shouldn't ever be thinking about it! Please keep it this way!

    -All Pick - this mode is casual and undermines the entire system. Players rank up on only a handful of heroes, but really have no thorough understanding of the game. It's NOT enjoyable playing with these people, but it only takes one of them to force you to have to play the type of game they insist on playing. Seriously, 70+% of Very High games have some BH in it and this is BORING. When you get paired with them in Very High they either do their thing or they throw the game and go to the next to do the same thing. Nobody is forced to diversify and play all the roles - something that should be a requirement for competitive mindset gameplay. Bad players are mingled with experienced ones because the system rewards them for dominating 50% of their games because they can execute the one or two strategies they know 50% of the time simply because the random amount of teamwork, which is the largest factor determining a game win, allowed them to.
    --I complain because if I don't queue All Pick I get max search bar queues every time. I know many good players I should be playing with, and also have RD/SD checked off, but they get garbled up in an AP game so fast that I never play them.
    --How do fix? Remove All Pick as a mode - or at least - give it its SEPARATE and NONRELATED RANKED queue system. Let the actually competitive modes be the standard ranked system and the casual All Pick mode be elsewhere. Creating this separation would also help scenarios of matchmaking with low skilled friends w/o ruining the experience for them/tanking your own as well as various other issues. Ranking people together takes away from this.
    --I also think this RD/SD only bracket should be solo queue only, but that's another fight for another day.

    -It's a no brainer, but make a Clan Queue system please. Give clans a couple more slots for alternates, timers on how many roster changes they can make in X amount of time, and let them duke it out with a Elo related ranking system. This will take nothing away from the rest of the queue - nobody wants to play 5 stacks unless they have one and nobody likes trying to find teams to scrim
    Last edited by smaweet; 01-26-2013 at 05:15 PM.

  9. #129
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    - it finds games

    - Everybody says it's fast. I'd argue it's not - 3 mins is a lot if somebody doesn't accept three times in a row and then after a couple more minutes one player fails to load the game in time. I don't believe you guys can't put players in bins faster than every 3 minutes. If you don't want to be faster because you're waiting for more players to join the pool, give me some feedback - the search range bar is not the feedback I want or need. Replace it with something meaningful, like approximate matching player count or whatever.

  10. #130
    -Being able to choose servers is nice.
    -The interface is great - being able to chat while searching, having hero selection in game, all that jazz is great.
    -The mode queueing works great. Love being able to select different modes, and the amount of the modes being added in is rad. I hope once more "stackable" modes are added, such as -dm, that you can stack terms. Even if it takes 30m to get into an All Random Deathmatch Itemdrop, I don't think it would fracture the playerbase by very much and would be fun.

    -Party MMR seems out of wack. I don't know exactly how it works, clearly, but this is the situation I'm in:

    When I queue by myself, I'm always in the "Very High." However, all my friends are not very good, and I still want to play with them. I know this is an awkward thing to match up, since I've played a few hundred games, and there are probably very few other teams that have "One very high MMR, 2-4 low MMR," but we are constantly matched against teams where every player has several hundred games played, while my friends have 25-100, meaning any lane matchup they'd take they are at an extreme disadvantage. This makes queuing with them unfun for both of us. I've made an alt to alleviate this, but it quickly bumped me up from low to high MMR, so clearly something on your end is working, to the disadvantage of my group's ability to play together. I wasn't hoping for me to just stomp everything in low queue, as that isn't fun for the other team at all, but no one on my team is having fun.

    I don't think this is really balance-able, but I'd want to participate with them in their games. Maybe some form of spectator, where I can see only one team on my friend's list's in real time? This would let me see what they're doing and be able to talk to them in skype or something. I'm not sure how to do this to prevent cheating. Maybe having an option to turn it off in custom games (for tournaments, scrims, etc), and separate queues (along the lines of ranked, non-ranked) and have it not work on the one that is deemed less casual or "noob-friendly."

    -Queueing for modes besides AP (and even AP in very high MMR), particularly Captains Mode, takes a long time. It is also awkward in general to think that my performance in Single Draft affects my MMR in Captain's Mode (which I assume it does?). I think this would also be remedied by separate queues, like Ranked and Non-Ranked, that have different MMR. So when I'm trying something outside my comfort zone like E/Q Invoker and perform not the greatest, I don't get punished by being viewed as worse by the system, even though my ability to play Support was uneffected and has very small correlation. This would make one of the queues for when I'm trying to serious, and would hopefully also lower queue times for this (which I assume would be Captains Mode).

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