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Thread: General Matchmaking Feedback Thread [READ OP]

  1. #41
    Basic Member Dr Quint's Avatar
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    Dec 2011
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    190
    DISLIKES

    - There's no visible list of "open lobbies" without password for people who don't want to match make but still want to find games.

    Oh wait, wrong thread.

  2. #42
    Basic Member
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    Jan 2013
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    3
    DISLIKES
    - I dislike getting matched with/against players with a big differential in wins compared to the average in my team.
    I don't like it because, with my main account with 300 games played getting a player with only a dozen wins will, most of the time, mean he's either getting flamed by my teammates and/or playing poorly compared to other players.
    This issue could be fixed by only matching people with similar amount of wins that also have a similar rating. For instance, a player could not be matched, even if he had a similar rating, with a player that has more than 100 wins of difference.

  3. #43
    LIKES
    - The UI feels inviting and very easy to navigate/use.
    - When queuing solo, games generally feel fair and balanced.

    DISLIKES
    - When playing with a party of ~3+, games start to feel like stomps either one way or the other. Of course you find the odd balanced match, but when you start to queue up with that many friends most of you will have a like-minded goal of either to; a) have fun, or b) win. If, for example Radiant team has a stack of 4 people just wanting to have some fun and play some video games together, but Dire team has a 3 stack that is super hardcore mode to win at all costs. Usually this would result in Dire just stomping the Radiant team simply because of the mindset of the players. If there was some way to distinguish between 'for fun' players and 'serious' players before a game started I guess that would help the problem a little, but it would still divide the community into 'elitists' and 'noobs'- so overall not very practical.

    - I can not open the player density map while in queue!

  4. #44
    Basic Member
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    Jun 2012
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    5
    LIKE

    I like that games with varied skill of players are still pretty decent in match making. I often play with friends so sometimes I play above my level, sometimes below, the matchmaking is pretty decent in setting this up for me.

    I like the game wait time, its pretty decent (the longer wait times would be at more obscure times ~1am as a 5 stack queuing only for CM) but it would be a nice feature if you could quick play where it attempts to match you close but most importantly fast. There will still be some issues with lesser played game modes though.

    I like how customizable the queuing is, the ability to queue for multiple modes across multiple servers (I live in Australia but if I just want a game asap, I still queue SEA alongside Aust)

    The people I am matched with are mostly supportive, attentive and willing. This could be due to great communication. I hear that many players in EU though struggle with people who only speak Russian (the xenophobia grows) there is an idea http://i.imgur.com/rccARlb.jpg to queue for language as well as region to help communication in game which is important considering that dota is a team game. I can see this helping in SEA where I used to and still do queue because I dont speak chinese/tagalog and it is difficult getting ideas and strategies over the language divide.

    DISLIKE

    When playing with lower level friends, I feel it is a bit too hard, I just cant carry and gank hard enough to make up for their lower laning capabilities. I understand you dont want smurfing to occur but it is depressing for them to get smashed in 9/10 lane match ups due to inferior skill and game sense. Perhaps you could nudge it a bit more into the easier zone as the system seems to work at higher levels due to general competency existing, at lower levels of play it seems to be slightly less adequate. Right now it seems I have to make a new account just so their experience is better.

    It seems that stacks still have an inherent advantage, especially at the higher levels of matchmaking. Perhaps you could identify stacks so people know what they are up against or match increasingly against them. I know that queue times for skilled players is long but the stacks seem to be winning far too often and easily in comparison to those who slug it out solo queue. I would love for team ranking and team plays (guaranteed 5 vs 5 stacking) http://www.reddit.com/r/DotA2/commen...w_do_you_feel/ so that those who stack will play against those who stack and the team work and good dota is brought out into the fore. I just seems like 5 stacks still have an inherent advantage (My win rate was higher in a 5 stack whan when solo/duo queuing), this could be due to problems finding player to suitable play against or that the coordination is just offers far too much supremacy. Despite this advantage, when we lose as a stack, we lose big. Completely one sided from minute 0. I dont know how to suggest you can fix it due to my lack of knowledge but the variables need to be tweaked somehow to prevent stomping and prevent getting stomped.

    I experience win and loss streaks, I am not particularly fond of them as the win streaks often feel shallow and are often stomps while the losses are demoralizing and bitter. I know Dota's match making is very reactive, perhaps after a series of losses it drops you faster to get that win which can get your head back into the game. When I lose, I lose hard, emotionally, it does hurt if game after game nothing seems to go right and by extension, the next time you roll you have a negative mindset and thus poor play (especially if you die, rage and anger seem to hit me harder in loss streaks than if I lose and win, win and lose).

    Despite knowing a fair amount about matchmaking, I dislike how uninformed or misinformed the player base are. Perhaps you can include a FAQ about dota2 in general somewhere in the game where you also address in a section, how MMR works. (People still think the buckets mean something when they are extremely general indicators). It will help people and get them more interested when they have the facts.

    I dislike that I dont know where I stand compared to the player base. Building on this, with DBR are dead, can we have a private acknowledgement of where we stand? Somewhere in the game it tells us that we are the 71-80 percentile or the 91-100 percentile with anything below 30 as 20-30 percentile to avoid hurting peoples feelings (although if you are that new to dota, you can tell that you are down there) I know dota doesnt like rankings but its nice to know where you stand in the grand scheme of things, even if it is +/- 5% of the player base (hundreds of thousands of people)
    Last edited by mrducky; 01-26-2013 at 07:39 AM.

  5. #45
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    19
    LIKES:

    The game is really great I love playing it!

    DISLIKES:

    No way to understand if i'm improving or not. Let there be an ELO that doesn't show until after the game but only show gains, not actual ELO. Keep it hidden until end of game and always keep it private only as in you can only see your own rating and standing. You shouldn't even be able to see your friends ELO. It should be private but I'd really like something to see how i'm doing and compare myself to the masses without having flamewars pregame.

    Sometimes you end up with 5 randoms vs 5 in a team. It's frustrating, let it take longer to match, always take into account how many are playing together , if there is 2 queing up, match with 2 others queing up in same skillevel ... 3 for 3 4 for 4 5 for 5 etc etc.

    Great game! Matchmaking seems really great but i'd like to know how i'm doing !

  6. #46
    Basic Member
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    Sep 2012
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    This is a slight modification from carlito's post from the first page, as I almost fully agreed with him:

    LIKE:
    • fast queue times
    • having to accept a game before starting it
    • high amount of server & mode options
    • extra bot matchmaking for newer players so they get the feel of playing with people but can face bots
    • Theoretically winnable games almost every time
    • [strike]no region locking, I can play with anyone all over the world[/strike]


    DISLIKE:
    • different view from players about the game. ranges from "meh i dont care ill just play whatever" to "let's make a proper team composition and give our bests"
      which leads to -> skills don't match at all. usually it's stomp or get stomped. this is no fun for either party involved
    • languages barriers for obvious reasons (honestly this sucks for both english and non-english speakers equally)
    • no way to tell if you improve or not
    • no way to get proper solo queues. i hate being solo and then running into a proper team just stomping. (no fun for either side)
    • adding the individual ratings is not a good way to measure a stack's rating and "stack" matches are therefore imbalanced most of the time
    • hard to get recognized by other people when you're really good but unknown
    • too little punishment for griefers / leavers / bad manners


    SUGGESTIONS/SOLUTIONS:

    The General idea is to have 3 different matchmaking queues.

    1. Ranked Team Matchmaking
    2. Ranked Matchmaking
    3. Unranked Matchmaking


    Furthermore
    • Language preferences
    • If you start a game and leave, you shouldn't be able to join a new one until the old one is finished


    And I'd like to add that it it very difficult to provide targeted feedback if you don't open up; Right now we are just guessing at how matchmaking works and maybe attributing all our bad matches to completely the wrong things. Of course know-it-alls will nitpick everything to pieces, but the MM reputation can hardly get worse. Right now, public opinion (or at least vocal opinion) seems to be 'MM sucks', if you open up and people disagree about a thousand different things, at least they will see that it's not so easy.

    Edit: Oh and to deal with the possible increase in obstinateness following on opening up ratings, you may want to instate a clear and concise Code of Conduct, and release a statement on your wish to 'detox' the playing environment
    Last edited by GewoonDaan; 01-26-2013 at 07:49 AM.

  7. #47
    Like:
    The amount of server options and especially the ready button. It really minimizes the afkers.

    Dislike:

    95% of the games seem to be really one sided. One time in the favour of my team the other time in favour of the other team. It seems that matchmaking lacks a good system to estimate the skill level of the players in the game.

    When i go matchmaking it takes rather long to get into a game. I don't think it is because my rating is very high or something. I'm not that awesome, but somehow it takes really long.

  8. #48
    Basic Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    14
    Likes:

    Fast queue times???

    Dislikes:

    -Teams. I dont like playing solo queue and getting matched up with 5 team members.Teams of 5 must play vs other teams of 5. On the other hand i dont have problems with 3-4 players of the same party.

    -Teamates. I dont like and understand that one day i play with high skilled players of known teams and the other day i play versus or with a guy that has 25-40 wins.

    -Stats. Some years ago there was a site for dota that was called Dota-League. You had a public rating and the system made decisions about the lineup according to them and it was fine. Yes there were flames some times but i can handle that. If i remember correctly flamers got 1-2 warnings and then got perma banned.Also you had to wait 2 weeks and later 1 month (not sure),to be able to play.So there wasnt many smurf accunts.The most awesome thing was the stats. I could see a guy name BabyKnigh to be first and i wanted to win more to catch him up. That guy got recognision for his good play and join a team of that time and won some tournaments if im currently remember. Also there was Dotalicious later another similar site with its own client wich had similar rules. Maelk was number 1 there and again it gave you motivation to climb up the ladder.

    Some people will say you statswhore and that they dont have fun playing like that. And i agree with them,i always played some more casual games with my friends on other clients and fun modes and private matches. But removing every aspect that makes this game a little more competive for a guy that plays only solo queue is sad and gameruining.I already made 2 brakes from dota 2 because of that. Playing 1 good game every day and 5 frustrating is not good enough.

    Make the game more competive for players that want that option. I want more motivation to keep playing and progressing that Dota 2 cosmetic items.

    You guys on the other hand, want me to play for cosmetic items.
    Last edited by Luck_duck; 01-26-2013 at 07:52 AM.

  9. #49
    Likes: I think the current MMR system is great and usually makes for good match ups.

    Cons: I don't like the fact I can't see where I am in the grand scheme of things. A similar system to DBR is required, make it personal and private though.

  10. #50
    Like:
    - No available stats aside from Wins and Losses. Stats stifle creativity. Don't know if this counts as part of match-making exactly, so I kept it brief.
    - Fast match making time.

    Dislikes:

    - I wouldn't mind so much about going up against a stack if I knew beforehand that they were a stack. Oftentimes, I just random my hero and play, while they strategically pick and counter-pick our heroes. If I know I'm up against a stack, I can at least try and counter-pick to my advantage because I'm expecting them to have a strategy planned out. Also, my team would also be more cautious and cooperative and be wary of things like level-1 Roshan, or getting 5 man ganked at the rune spots or as the creep wave is coming out. It's rare to have this level of cooperation in mid level games (not sure about high level randoms). So, if you could just put a little star or something next to players in a stack that would be great.

    I hope the next two points aren't off topic. Apologize in advance if it is.

    - The inclusion of team leagues would be much appreciated. Dota is meant to be played 5 v 5, team vs team. It's hard looking for in-house leagues and whatnot for people on the low-mid level skill spectrum. Perhaps the player base is currently too small for this at the moment, but it'd be a nice addition.

    - Mini-Tournaments would also be awesome. Throwing these encourages more people to form teams instead of solo queuing all the time. You could have a low, mid and high tier weekend tournament (perhaps separated by server as well to keep things going quickly), kind of like how Warcraft III had small tournaments sporadically, and offer the top teams from each division some in game items and maybe a little trophy case in their profile to say they won.

    - At the end of a match, people should have a "play with the same team" voting option. If it's unanimous, you can have your own kind of stack now for the next match-making session. I basically have no friends in DotA because my friends are too intimidated by the game or the skills are horribly mismatched. If DotA already made a team for you and you're supposed to be at about the same level, this problem is solved. I'm always too focused on playing the game than asking for contact info and it doesn't occur to me what great chemistry we had 'til the end but it's too hard rallying everyone together once they disconnect and just queue up another game.
    Last edited by NO-FATCHICKS; 01-26-2013 at 08:37 AM. Reason: Thought of a new thing to add.

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