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Thread: General Matchmaking Feedback Thread [READ OP]

  1. #981
    Basic Member Inritus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MJK View Post
    I agree with the smurf detection suggestion ... And what i suggested was that there is a smurf / new player pool that matches smurfs and new players together .. The good smurfs will be matched with other good smurfs in few games and new players well they play new players . The 50 game thing was just an example .. I have to disagree with you on the reports since they work correctly only for verbal abuse . People get muted and sent to low pool but that is not a direct hit against the griefers .. Example "I grief your game i get reported i go to low pool or get muted " "If i get muted .. No big deal continue grief if i go to low pool ... no big deal continue grief " than go back to my bracket and repeat .. and all so you can w8 out your mute / low pool .. I think BANS and i mean big bans is the right way ...since other tools to dealing with griefers are usles .. Or maybe custom ban lists or stuff like that ... Id say the best i have seen is make people choose ONLY one language and make the reports have more weight on people that still talk different languages than the chosen ones ... For me going in English MM and talking russ for example is the same as griefing ... I talked shit because the way you made your 1st post for me was a total noob post and still is ..I told you there " YOu look like a guy who thinks dota is a Hero by hero game witch for me is not true there are heroes with different tools but the over all goal is the same and the over all strategy for each class need very little tweaking for a specific hero in that class " And than you nail picked 1 guy from the pro scene that doesnt know ward spot to counter my argument witch is dumb as well ..
    You don't get put in LPQ for mute reports. What exactly is the problem in your example? They flame and get muted, they grief and get in LPQ, where they're with their peers just like you suggested earlier? (Separate griefer league).

    Really don't understand how my first post made you think that. And, as this is the fourth time it will be my last attempt at explaining it for you: you stated failing at basics should warrant punishment, I told you even pro players can fall under your definition of bad play, thus it was not very reasonable. Whether it's only one guy or not (it's most definitely not, if it is true for a pro player it's true for many others) is irrelevant. One was enough to prove my point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
    The problem is that the bad game is bad because, tiny is feeding because is angry with jugger. Weaver goes afk after being killed 3 times after run on wards and Windrunner is in dual mid with Drow because both said "I mid" at start.

    Then someone leaves the game, someone doesn't stop to DC and everyone threats everyone with reports and speaks about each other families.
    And how is this the fault of the matchmaking? It can only considering stuff before the match has started.
    Last edited by Inritus; 10-30-2013 at 11:11 AM.

  2. #982
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    I have 11 straight losses. Yep.

    Would really like some sort of matchmaking.

  3. #983
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lajkonik View Post
    Your experience is not evidence - it is just your experience, biased opinion.

    Most people overesitmate their ability and underestimate the ability of their peers. It's called Dunning-Kruger effect.
    I'd love an explanation of why after I go on win streaks I suddenly get more and more spanish speaking players on my team until I lose.

  4. #984
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trubs View Post
    I'd love an explanation of why after I go on win streaks I suddenly get more and more spanish speaking players on my team until I lose.
    Equalibrium! When you get on a losing strike just spend next two-three hours doing something else. :]

  5. #985
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lajkonik View Post
    No, those people don't realize that. They think they would have 80% win rates because they are "that good". They simply don't understand how rating systems work.



    They won. Yes, smurf detection. The 2 wins guy was not playing bad by the standards of that game. I think you're just jealous that someone is good enough to play with Dendi and you're so bad that you're stuck in 'Normal' games and complain about your teammates all day long.



    It matches you with people of your ilk. If they're retards, you're one of them.
    How can you even say that? Like honestly.. Haven't you seen pro players stream? Have you seen some of the players they get matched with? I can recall on several occasions singsing got a player who just completely feeds and has no idea what he's doing. I remember one instance a while ago when you could still see players win amounts where singsing got a viper on his team who had 12 wins, went 0/3 and abandoned the game. I have seen tons of other pro players get people who are clueless on their team as well.

    Personally I queue in Very High 100% of the time, and I have for the last 2 years, and I still get feeders and completely new players on my team fairly often, and I'd wager at least 50% of the people im matched with don't speak english (USE server, only English selected). How are you going to act like the matchmaking isn't broken?

  6. #986
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inritus View Post

    And how is this the fault of the matchmaking? It can only considering stuff before the match has started.
    And again:
    Quote Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
    In case that someone miss that part, I want to make clear that I wasn't making suppositions about the MM system including variables like "abandoned games" "report counts" it is like that, obviously it is, you don't need to be a genius to understand the variables that the programers are using for it.

    Abandoned games
    Reports sent (by you) (against you)
    number of games played
    time expend in the game
    number of friends in game
    hats owned, servers chosen
    kind of games chosen...

    It is just the tip of the iceberg about all the data that as a programer you can collect from people in game!!

    And yes, with it you can make a extremely clean pattern about what kind of player every one is. And yes of course it is used on the matchmaking.

    If someone believes that matchmaking works only with kills, assistances and number of games (lost/win). then you are absolutely wrong. And there is nothing I can do for you.

    So my post is not for discuss about it, is about how they use this data, and how, as soon as you start to have some win streaks in pub games (because obviously if you play with a team it cant happen) the MM starts to team you up with crappy players who have a very high chance to go AFK in middle of the game, leave the game or just don't play as a team.

    It works in this way because its easy to control the system in this way and make everyone feel like you are not better or worst than others (valves main goal).

    But this is not fair at all in a competitive video game. People who doesn't play in group also deserves play with others players with the same average of skills. Not just become a "variable n" for a system trying to keep everyone on the same level.

    And if someone doesn't understand it:
    1- You don't play in pubs alone
    2- You are part of those bad players
    3- You have a lack of perception/understating

    DOTA 2 is a competitive game, so it doesn't have to be about to keep the equilibrium, it has to be about to create a difference between skilled and not skilled players. But seems like it is not good good for valve business model, so they work in this way.

    And yes that's why we also don't have a ladder system. Because if it was more competitive, then a lot of unskilled DOTA players would leave the game. And less people playing game means less hats, and here hats means everything since valve is a company and hats are paying the bills.

    So finally DOTA 2 is only competitive for teams and pro scene. Everyone else is a hat buyer and is part of the 50% system. And if you don't like call it 50% system, call it intentional equilibrium of skilled and unskilled players.

  7. #987
    Basic Member uzztdrd2's Avatar
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    It is indeed fucked up. I started with a 100% winrate after my first game and went down to 57% after some hundreds.

  8. #988
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
    You know what is really wrong with this MM.

    It is not the 50% goal.

    The problem is that for make you stay at 50% MM doesn't make you play against stronger opponents. (what would be great)
    MM just makes you play with all the scum on this game, rage quitters, leavers, afkrs.

    So that's why MM works that well.

    Because if at minute 10, someone feed, someone quit, and someone is afk, how are you supposed to win?

    A good MM would make players who are winning play against better players not play with worst teammates.
    This. Frikkin this! What is Volvo doing with mah gaem!

  9. #989
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trubs View Post
    How can you even say that? Like honestly.. Haven't you seen pro players stream? Have you seen some of the players they get matched with? I can recall on several occasions singsing got a player who just completely feeds and has no idea what he's doing. I remember one instance a while ago when you could still see players win amounts where singsing got a viper on his team who had 12 wins, went 0/3 and abandoned the game. I have seen tons of other pro players get people who are clueless on their team as well.

    Personally I queue in Very High 100% of the time, and I have for the last 2 years, and I still get feeders and completely new players on my team fairly often, and I'd wager at least 50% of the people im matched with don't speak english (USE server, only English selected). How are you going to act like the matchmaking isn't broken?
    Because him and inritus derived some strange pleasure from being placed in "very high". They are feeling elite and better than the rest. Even though other VH players (myself included) can see this bullshit for what it is. they will keep defending it because its basically defending their self esteem (which is derived from a video game sadly).

  10. #990
    Basic Member Inritus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcady View Post
    And again:
    Thinking the stats you listed will predict player personalities and behavior is nothing but delusional. Think we're done arguing here if that is your stance.

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