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Thread: Laning Phase Farming

  1. #1
    Volunteer Moderator CvP's Avatar
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    Laning Phase Farming

    I think bots not denying/harassing at all in "medium" and denying/harassing almost everything in "hard" is kinda bad.

    IMO, bots should deny in "hard" but will mistime their deny/last hits quite a bit of times.

    In unfair, they should deny/LH like current hard difficulty.

  2. #2
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    I agree that rather than having reaction times with last hits they should occasionally fire too soon or too late like humans do. Even the best players miss last hits every so often even with no pressure. It's rare but it does occur, let alone the level the bots are at. If you don't screw with them, the bots NEVER miss a last hit and get most denies.

    The higher their 'stress' from varying factors is (low health, outnumbered in lane etc.) the higher chance there is of them messing up a last hit. Also factors are characters with slow or difficult attack animations. You do get used to it, but it's still not as easy as last hitting with a character that has a good animation.

  3. #3
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    I dunno, I think it would be better if medium bots denied but just did it poorly, and hard bots were kept the same, to narrow difficulty gap. I personally like where hard bots are right now. Even with their reaction times they do still miss from time to time but the chance is low. Although, for a more realistic simulation, it might be good to widen the reaction time range to something like 25-100ms, as opposed to 50-75ms (the way it is right now). Also hero attack animations do affect their last hitting abilities a bit - like lina and zeus are worse at it than viper for example, HOWEVER, I do think they don't appear to be as affected by it as their human counter parts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by assteepee View Post
    they do still miss from time to time but the chance is low.
    They do not miss unless you have any advantage for example: use spell, they are range while you are melee, you have much higher damage etc.

    IF they hit a creep, they WILL get last hit or deny unless something from above happens.


    The problem is, this puts off the new people a lot. From medium where bots do not deny nor do they harass you, they come to hard and bots do perfect farming + harass...I have seen them feeling frustrated.

    Need something in between to get them used to it.

  5. #5
    Basic Member Chane's Avatar
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    I would turn down the harras on hard just a tad while increasing the harras on medium by a tad.

    its like going from easy to hard right now imo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chane View Post
    I would turn down the harras on hard just a tad while increasing the harras on medium by a tad.

    its like going from easy to hard right now imo
    They don't harass at all in medium. Only attack back if you attack.

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    They barely harass in unfair, I don't see the problem with them not doing it at all on medium, also their lasthitting sucks on unfair, reducing it to hard difficulty is just stupid. It does not matter how good or bad I am at the game, you can't claim that the bots have perfect farming abilities and good harass if I can outfarm a Krobelus mid as Balanar, WR, BM, Magnus, etc.

  8. #8
    Basic Member Chane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shamanics View Post
    They barely harass in unfair, I don't see the problem with them not doing it at all on medium, also their lasthitting sucks on unfair, reducing it to hard difficulty is just stupid. It does not matter how good or bad I am at the game, you can't claim that the bots have perfect farming abilities and good harass if I can outfarm a Krobelus mid as Balanar, WR, BM, Magnus, etc.
    try sf mid vs viper on hard/unfair with a bottle rush build.

  9. #9
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    Yeah bot Viper is really annoying to fight against because of nethertoxin. The AI's 'perfect' accuracy with last hits and denies really comes through there and not to mention that, the very moment you come into range of Vipers attacks whether to harass him or get a last hit, he will instareact poison attack you.

    This is a big reason why the bots can't handle him either and usually end up feeding him. Yes it's possible to beat this behavior especially if you pick a hero who can deal with it but it then gets into the territory of exploiting the AI and using tactics and thinking that isn't worth considering against a human.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chane View Post
    try sf mid vs viper on hard/unfair with a bottle rush build.
    I forgot to take the min 10 screenshot, but that was my CS by 10:00~, I went to check the rune top and it was bottom and then took the SS, the allvision was just to make sure Viper was not buying wards and losing gold on it.





    Says replay not recorded, will check later if it appears or what, either way, I am pretty bad at SF, missed a couple of razes and blablabla, could have killed him when I got a haste but failed hard to do so. Viper harassed me so little that I was not even forced to use the 3 tangoes I started with, I consumed my last when at full health to get my yasha, I could probably get to 65 or more CS with a bit of practice on SF and also a couple of kills on the Viper, either way, I don't see your point that bots harass a lot, I barely noticed Viper on the lane, he was just annoying on the early levels.
    Last edited by Shamanics; 03-06-2013 at 06:17 PM.

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