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Thread: Bot usefulness tier list

  1. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avs View Post
    Luna does not help setup teamfights or even stun properly: When stun is on cooldown and chasing a hero in range she does not use it. Same with DK. Same with Tiny.

    Tiny seems to never use Toss. Needs a revamp of its AI.

    Dragonknight never uses stuns appropriately. He just throws it out there wasting it.
    Usually I find that Luna is one of the only bots that properly casts her spells while chasing (probably due to the immense range). I mostly notice this during the laning phase though, perhaps while in team fights she's waiting for other heroes to cast their stuns before she casts hers, not realizing that they aren't in range. I've speculated before that this may be the cause of their retarded chasing AI, by setting up an order of heroes out of range, thus a hero gets away cause they're waiting for a hero who's not there to do the first stun.

    Tiny only uses Toss in his combo, never outside of it from my experience (unless Avalance is on cooldown I think.. but he'll only toss the hero he's going for in the air, he'll never toss someone at a hero, even if it would kill the the hero)

  2. #132
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    Necro + kunkka lane is awesomely hard to play against!!

  3. #133
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    Its a bit dated now. Necro is significantly better since now he puts one point in heartstopper at level 1. I was considering making a new list but honestly I don't know if it was a recent change or a coincidence but while there was always a difference between allied bots and enemy bots it seems a lot larger than before. I sense I'd be dumping a lot of bots into the bottom tier nowadays, especially if we are only basing on their effectiveness on the human side as I did with Necrolyte at the time who was pretty damn awful on human side but pretty decent on AI side.

    He's still got some of those odd traits of his (overestimating his bulk and overextending) but it seems most of the bots have this these days when on the human side @_@. It's not that enemy bots don't do it, they just don't do it as frequently, nor do they walk alone into 3-5 members of the enemy team and die horribly.
    Last edited by Peachrocks; 04-14-2013 at 11:21 AM.

  4. #134
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    Only found this thread recently, very interesting stuff.

    I have edited every bot to remove errors etc, found only a few, usually just "items_derived" "item_treads" (should be power_treads) etc. Moved on to trying to improve the bots and am stuck on Venge, who is consistently under-performing. Jugg is a beast now, he snowballs so fast, but venge is feeding hard, any tips...?

  5. #135
    Mind posting your npc_heroes.txt?

  6. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jace11 View Post
    Only found this thread recently, very interesting stuff.

    I have edited every bot to remove errors etc, found only a few, usually just "items_derived" "item_treads" (should be power_treads) etc. Moved on to trying to improve the bots and am stuck on Venge, who is consistently under-performing. Jugg is a beast now, he snowballs so fast, but venge is feeding hard, any tips...?
    How does your VS look? Item build/skill build.
    It's a tricky thing with her though, because the hero is really kind of extremely limited. Her biggest use is just to swap the enemy carry into her entire team or a single stun, neither of which are amazing...

    Try to get some quick cheap support items up, about 2-3 at least, after which just go for something like Manta.
    Don't get Aghanim's, I don't feel the bots can utilize it well enough for the investment considering it has no synergy with her preferred stats at all.
    Also, you could make her go Blademail actually, seeing as the bots don't seem to mind nuking a blademail target and she'll often get focused, though it really is just promoting her suicidal tendecies.

  7. #137
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    Ok, thanks, Ill try pushing manta further up her build order.

    Ill post the heroes.txt shortly, I need to check it after each game update and there was a small one after the abaddon patch.

    I have done a few things, build orders, skill orders etc. There aren't many errors in the stock files, but for example, LUNA has in her default build:

    Code:
    "Loadout"
    			{
    				"item_flask"					"ITEM_CONSUMABLE | ITEM_SELLABLE"
    				"item_tango"					"ITEM_CONSUMABLE | ITEM_SELLABLE"
    				"item_ring_of_protection"		"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_branches"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_branches"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_branches"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_magic_stick"				"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_recipe_magic_wand"		"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_magic_wand"				"ITEM_DERIVED | ITEM_SELLABLE"
    				"item_sobi_mask"				"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_ring_of_basilius"			"ITEM_DERIVED"
    				"item_boots"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_slippers"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_circlet"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_recipe_wraith_band"		"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_ring_of_aquila"			"ITEM_DERIVED | ITEM_SELLABLE"
    				"item_boots_of_elves"			"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_gloves"					"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_treads"					"ITEM_DERIVED"
    				"item_blade_of_alacrity"		"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_boots_of_elves"			"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_recipe_yasha"				"ITEM_CORE"
    				"item_yasha"					"ITEM_DERIVED"
    				"item_ultimate_orb"				"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_recipe_manta"				"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_manta"					"ITEM_DERIVED"
    				"item_ogre_axe"					"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_mithril_hammer"			"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_recipe_black_king_bar"	"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_black_king_bar"			"ITEM_DERIVED"
    				"item_eagle"					"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_quarterstaff"				"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_talisman_of_evasion"		"ITEM_EXTENSION"
    				"item_butterfly"				"ITEM_DERIVED"
    				"item_platemail"				"ITEM_LUXURY"
    				"item_hyperstone"				"ITEM_LUXURY"
    				"item_chainmail"				"ITEM_LUXURY"
    				"item_recipe_assault"			"ITEM_LUXURY"
    				"item_assault"					"ITEM_DERIVED"
    Errors here include no belt of strength for her treads (bands?) and the item derived is named incorrectly as "item_treads", should be "item_power_treads" etc.. This derived bug is present on several bots but I'm not sure if this prevents the building of treads, pretty sure it doesn't, however in Luna's case, the wrong component items would.

  8. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jace11 View Post
    Ok, thanks, Ill try pushing manta further up her build order.

    Ill post the heroes.txt shortly, I need to check it after each game update and there was a small one after the abaddon patch.

    I have done a few things, build orders, skill orders etc. There aren't many errors in the stock files, but for example, LUNA has in her default build:

    Code:
    "Loadout"
    			{
    				...
    Errors here include no belt of strength for her treads (bands?) and the item derived is named incorrectly as "item_treads", should be "item_power_treads" etc.. This derived bug is present on several bots but I'm not sure if this prevents the building of treads, pretty sure it doesn't, however in Luna's case, the wrong component items would.
    The treads thing isn't really an issue. The item derived is mainly for a couple of things, one for readability for the human, two in case the item also needs to be marked as sellable. Perhaps the bots also use it for weighing a persons items in some way, but only ChrisC can tell that. Either way, as long as it's not marked as a sellable item, item_derived may just as well not be there from the bots' perspective.

    Also, for the updating thing, you have this: http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?...l=1#post621376
    I would've posted the program I use myself but I still haven't fixed my old PC's motherboard where the program's stored at, replacement should arrive this week hopefully!

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