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Thread: [Intended] Weaver's swarm does not deal any dmg to towers

  1. #1
    Basic Member EbToX's Avatar
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    [Intended] Weaver's swarm does not deal any dmg to towers

    Summary: If you used swarm towards an enemy Tower it should deal some dmg to it

    Repro:
    1)pick weaver and skill Swarm
    2)Use swarm against enemy Tower

    Result:
    Nothing happens, Tower doesn't get damaged.

    Expected Result:
    Tower should get some damage while the swarm is passing through it.

    EDIT:Added videos (sorry for bad quality)
    DotA 1

    DotA 2
    Last edited by EbToX; 05-01-2013 at 11:02 AM. Reason: Added Video

  2. #2
    Basic Member EbToX's Avatar
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    !BUMP

  3. #3
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    that's quite some damage.
    added to sticky.

    would lean towards an intended fix though.
    Make sure to read the Forum Rules as well as the stickied Threads of the Forum Section you are posting in.

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  4. #4
    Basic Member EbToX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blash365 View Post
    that's quite some damage.
    added to sticky.

    would lean towards an intended fix though.
    I think it depends on the way the bugs come out of weaver (e.g in the first video look at the last swarm i threw, most of the bugs were close to each other thus more bugs hit the tower) .And even if you consider the fact that some of the bugs get attached to enemy units i don't think the dmg is that significant.

  5. #5
    Basic Member ThoAppelsin's Avatar
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    I also would call this as an unintended occurance in DotA.
    The swarm beetles are just some units that are made to face towards the direction they are getting moved against, and have 90 attack range, 8 collision size, and 60 degrees of propulsion window

    I had found this fact while I was doing random tests. This is not a tower specific issue at all. This happens to any unit. When you cast the swarm against a single unit, you'll see that occasionally the target gets 7~8 instances of damage with level 1 swarm, while it should be 6. The one extra instance comes from another beetle on the swarm that was passing by
    Those extra instances do not reduce the armor

    They can basically attack every unit, not just towers. Towers have relatively high collision size, apparently making them getting attacked more often
    They can attack to couriers aswell, or Serpent Wards for example, or ancient neutrals
    just everything that is attackable


    But still, I would rather like to have it back. It would be good to watch if any Weaver had managed to last hit a tower from afar with the swarm, or kill a low-health escaping courier
    I did not think of a tower case back then... I have only seen that they were dealing 6~8 instances of damage to a hero although it should be 6, but since I knew it was only an occasional occurance, I had decided not to report it

  6. #6
    Basic Member Kaneomanie's Avatar
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    Well, maybe there shouldn't be multiple hits occuring but them attacking buildings once makes sense if it's that way in dota 1, could set the damage vs buildings to 0 in dota 1 if Icefrog wanted, right?

  7. #7
    Basic Member ThoAppelsin's Avatar
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    No, there is no such thing as setting the damage against a unit... tower for your example

    You can make a 5th version of beetle with none of their attacks enabled, use those beetles as the visual flight of The Swarm at any level, then when it comes to latching, you can completely destroy one of those 5th types of beetles that was flying, and create a new beetle that corresponds the stored level of the swarm when it was used, right next to the unit that has been detected to get latched a beetle. This way, the units that fly just for the visual purpose won't be damaging any of the units around

    I would say the reason why it hasn't been done like this is a "cannot be arsed" case. Of course I might be wrong, and IceFrog could have just wanted the swarm itself while flying to be able to attack
    And if I am wrong, then this has to happen against every unit as I've said before, not just towers

  8. #8
    Basic Member shalafi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThoAppelsin View Post
    No, there is no such thing as setting the damage against a unit... tower for your example

    You can make a 5th version of beetle with none of their attacks enabled, use those beetles as the visual flight of The Swarm at any level, then when it comes to latching, you can completely destroy one of those 5th types of beetles that was flying, and create a new beetle that corresponds the stored level of the swarm when it was used, right next to the unit that has been detected to get latched a beetle. This way, the units that fly just for the visual purpose won't be damaging any of the units around

    I would say the reason why it hasn't been done like this is a "cannot be arsed" case. Of course I might be wrong, and IceFrog could have just wanted the swarm itself while flying to be able to attack
    And if I am wrong, then this has to happen against every unit as I've said before, not just towers
    Adding to the speculation, I think the swarm is the result of experimenting with a skill until it feels right, and I think it worked way different at the beginning. My guess is that he wanted the swarm to feel like a Zergling attack. They were probably units created and ordered to attack the targeted point, with movement and AI of their own. But obviously the result was devastating against a single unit, plus they wouldn't truly overrun, but instead stop at the first few targets. After a few changes and scripting, he ended with the current version, which needs the armour reduction to be worth it since each bettle only attacks one unit. But due to what they were at the beginning, the bettles are able to attack freely, much like the (maybe) original behaviour.

  9. #9
    Basic Member ThoAppelsin's Avatar
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    Good speculation, nice read, would read again

    and I think it's all good to keep it as a confirmed bug until they get officially confirmed otherwise, like every other valid report should

  10. #10
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    I think swarm should be change to deal damage to all unit not only tower @_@

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